What has happened to the birth place of SOT fishing?

[rhyak]

Whats happened... I am talking So-Cal in general

Multiple Forums down here in So-Cal all have few to no post on a weekly basis... Whats up with that.

LJ fished daily, no reports to really speak of.
Takes 8-10 post to actually find pictures of our awesome fishery.
The bay's is fished daily if not weekly for sure, rarely a report.
There are a couple 1000 members on here with not even half of you being active at all. Whats your deal?


When a good report does get posted fail not someone will come over and bash it... So why post right that is how I look at it.

Should I, "NO"
Should you "NO"
Post away.

What I am saying is there are forums up and down the rest of this county that are just flourishing right now and the So-Cal ones not so much...

Is it the MLPA causing it, I don't think so.
The MLPA is young in SoCal. Been around on the Central Coast for a decade.


Do not want this to turn into a locked thread so lets keep it light.
But what is going on down here but no where else in the country?

[makobob]

2X, GREAT question? What's going on with our community? Active memberhip down to 830.

[bosshoss]

:dontknow:

[danjor]

Don't know, I'm on here every day, probably don't post as many reports as I should but I also don't go out as much as I used to and most of the time not much to report. But I try.

[wiredantz]

here are the answers:

#1
The answer is, Southern California is crowded, so very very crowded, many people feel like they do not want their honey hole ambushed with 20 million powerboaters.


#2

I heard their were some bandits chasing other fisherman with Gaffs

#3


Some people just don't care anymore, and don't want to me bothered with being politically correct to post or not to post

# 4

after a while a fish is a fish, and don't feel likes is a big deal to post.

# 5

some people ostracize you if you post....

[PAL]

Angler numbers and the relatively advanced age of the kayak fishing scene have a lot to do with the situation. As did web fragmentation (devolution). And the local concentration of most kayak anglers into relatively few fishing spots.

Consider also the collapse of the tournament schedule, which was largely but not solely offered and supported by retailers. I was very sorry to see the demise of the Moyer Memorial, at the time the longest running kayak fishing tournament in the world. Don't forget the red tape - permits and insurance are required for most events staged down here.

I think I have a broader perspective than most, and I've been around a long time. I've thought about and discussed these issues for years. The rise of code groups, Facebook and the MLPA have played a part. The modern birthplace of kayak fishing at Pt Dume is an MPA, no fishing, no-how. How's that for an insult?

Kayak anglers who are enjoying a heyday in other regions at least know what to watch for.

[monkeyfishturds]

People fish because they enjoy it Ryan. Sharing on the internet is a personal choice. You'd be surprised how many fishermen don't want to share their lives with strangers on the internet. Don't be bothered by peoples choices.

[rhyak]

People fish because they enjoy it Ryan. Sharing on the internet is a personal choice. You'd be surprised how many fishermen don't want to share their lives with strangers on the internet. Don't be bothered by peoples choices.


Thanks for using one of your 29 post in the last 4 years on this...

:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

[bus kid]

People fish because they enjoy it Ryan. Sharing on the internet is a personal choice. You'd be surprised how many fishermen don't want to share their lives with strangers on the internet. Don't be bothered by peoples choices.

winner winner chicken dinner!

[jruiz]

Dare I say a fishing community can exist without a forum? I believe the forum has served its purpose as a source for information and an avenue to get together for larger group events. My belief is no forum can replace a day out on the water alone or with your fishing buddies and that many have become so reliant on online communities that they can't function in social situations anymore. I applaud your intentions but speaking fort myself i've dedicated as much effort as I allowably can, any more is a distraction from the actual sport of kayak fishing.

[fishingfiend]

I agree rhyak, the forum scene is pretty tough here. It almost seems as if the kayak fishing forums all peaked a couple of years ago. I also believe the hardcore kayak angler is a solitary creature, as a result not very chatty on the boards.

[rhyak]

Angler numbers and the relatively advanced age of the kayak fishing scene have a lot to do with the situation. As did web fragmentation (devolution). And the local concentration of most kayak anglers into relatively few fishing spots.

Consider also the collapse of the tournament schedule, which was largely but not solely offered and supported by retailers. I was very sorry to see the demise of the Moyer Memorial, at the time the longest running kayak fishing tournament in the world. Don't forget the red tape - permits and insurance are required for most events staged down here.

I think I have a broader perspective than most, and I've been around a long time. I've thought about and discussed these issues for years. The rise of code groups, Facebook and the MLPA have played a part. The modern birthplace of kayak fishing at Pt Dume is an MPA, no fishing, no-how. How's that for an insult?

Kayak anglers who are enjoying a heyday in other regions at least know what to watch for.

I agree to some aspects. The crowds do not seem to participate any longer. But why is that. Is the question.

Someone said over crowding, not sure if anyone is familiar with the BAY area but pretty damn populated and overcrowded and they seem to share just fine.

Is it because the MLPA is fresh down here and still hurts. Central Coast has had MLPAs for what? 10 years, most of the north coast ones pushing 6+ years, still there obviously but hurts. Some great locations no longer available, but still a lot of great locations to discover and share with friends.

Im pretty sure there was a time when the Albion Open was called ELK but that individual let the MLPA take him away from the Kayak community from what I have heard, with all due respect for this person, our we all gonna let this happen to the socal scene or is it already too late, due to not being able to fish certain area's.
We need it to bring us together, for the next battle that will arrive before we know it and need to be standing 300 strong not 30 strong...

There should be comradery among all of us not hatred and regret that's how it almost feels. Paul you know how that feels when you go to a NCKA event everyone is family and that's how it should be down here.

Regards,

Ryan

[lowprofile]

if you have questions, they will generally be answered but looking for up to date reports from a bunch of guys who eat, breath and dream of fishing and catch fish consistantly...not going to happen. there is no joy from posting pics of the same fish over and over. I'm sure if a run of yellowfin or BFT made it up this way the forum would be flooded. but its till just yellowtail, wsb, halibut and a bunch of bottom fish.

we are all guilty of the Noob posts of our first fish or 20. then its just pointless because its the same tactics and probably same area over and over but you still get flooded with questions from people too lazy to do research or try something new OR if you post too much your taking too many fish and the MLPA is now your fault AND you've given away the super secret bite that really never ends all year.

[Bennyblanco]

here are the answers:

#1
The answer is, Southern California is crowded, so very very crowded, many people feel like they do not want their honey hole ambushed with 20 million powerboaters.


#2

I heard their were some bandits chasing other fisherman with Gaffs

#3


Some people just don't care anymore, and don't want to me bothered with being politically correct to post or not to post

# 4

after a while a fish is a fish, and don't feel likes is a big deal to post.

# 5

some people ostracize you if you post....



#5 for me. Disappoint with some of members that I met in the water and they try to avoid you.don't want to mention names but, there part of some sewish spill team.

[alanw]

It might just be SoCal in general. People here suck for the most part, probably just because there are too many here. Head up north a bit and people are more likely to stop and talk, and just seem more friendly in general from my experience.

There are some great fishing reports here but they are few and far between.

A few guys here will never post anything relevant about their catch, only a few pictures with the background erased, and a location called the pacific ocean. They're showing us new guys how it should be done I guess.

[BrokeLoser]

Whats happened... I am talking So-Cal in general

Multiple Forums down here in So-Cal all have few to no post on a weekly basis... Whats up with that.

LJ fished daily, no reports to really speak of.
Takes 8-10 post to actually find pictures of our awesome fishery.
The bay's is fished daily if not weekly for sure, rarely a report.
There are a couple 1000 members on here with not even half of you being active at all. Whats your deal?


When a good report does get posted fail not someone will come over and bash it... So why post right that is how I look at it.

Should I, "NO"
Should you "NO"
Post away.

What I am saying is there are forums up and down the rest of this county that are just flourishing right now and the So-Cal ones not so much...

Is it the MLPA causing it, I don't think so.
The MLPA is young in SoCal. Been around on the Central Coast for a decade.


Do not want this to turn into a locked thread so lets keep it light.
But what is going on down here but no where else in the country?

I don't intend to offend you with this but lets be honest; in 18 months you've only posted an average of 4.67 times per month. You're not exactly super "active" around here.
What is it you expect to gain personally with regard to whether or not this forum is blowing up?
It's been said here over and over that "honey hole" locations and or hot spot numbers will not be given while they're hot. All you'll really ever get out of a "fish report" is another photo of another yellowtail, halibut, WSB...etc etc. If that's what excites you I'd suggest the following: www.google.com then type in yellowtail / halibut / WSB and click images.

If it's information related to your kayak and how to make it better you're after then their is a shit-ton of that info already here and if it's not already here then their are a shit-ton of people here that love to be helpful. (just don't ask them where to catch fish...haha)

[ful-rac]

#5 for me. Disappoint with some of members that I met in the water and they try to avoid you.don't want to mention names but, there part of some sewish spill team.


Oh I sorry you are "disappoint" with the "sewish spill team", I'm assuming your referring to team sewer?

Have you ever introduced yourself to anyone of us? I don't ever remember ever meeting you.

Stinkymatt runs the complaint department maybe you want to get ahold of him hopefully he can resolve your issue.


In all seriousness were all really cool guys...at least I like to think so. If anyone is unlucky enough to run into any of us on the water don't be afraid to introduce yourself....we won't bite....



HARD!

[dorado50]

Sign of the times.....an evolution if you will.

[wiredantz]

I don't intend to offend you with this but lets be honest; in 18 months you've only posted an average of 4.67 times per month. You're not exactly super "active" around here.
What is it you expect to gain personally with regard to whether or not this forum is blowing up?
It's been said here over and over that "honey hole" locations and or hot spot numbers will not be given while they're hot. All you'll really ever get out of a "fish report" is another photo of another yellowtail, halibut, WSB...etc etc. If that's what excites you I'd suggest the following: www.google.com then type in yellowtail / halibut / WSB and click images.

If it's information related to your kayak and how to make it better you're after then their is a shit-ton of that info already here and if it's not already here then their are a shit-ton of people here that love to be helpful. (just don't ask them where to catch fish...haha)


just fyi: ryan is a legend



he is one of those guys that drinks DOS Xs beer


one time his kayak sank and he split the waters so he can walk on dry land to little harbor

or something like that


and I think he runs central kayak fishing forum

just fyi

[BrokeLoser]

just fyi: ryan is a legend



he is one of those guys that drinks DOS Xs beer


one time his kayak sank and he split the waters so he can walk on dry land to little harbor

or something like that


and I think he runs central kayak fishing forum

just fyi

A legend?
Like Babe Ruth and Michael Jordan?

[Smthtnnr]

I see what you're saying, but I think a big thing is there are a lot of lazy and newbie guys that wait to see reports and basically mooch off of the guys spending time on the water. If they don't see report, they don't take our fish. I'm new to the forum so I don't really know for sure, but that's my take.

[buddha]

I think it is sad that you got mostly negative replies.

I think you want more camaraderie but some people will just not open their hearts for that for some reason.

Many just want to stay to themselves.

I am happy that Makobob has organized some Mexican trips and I will be going with a small group of guys to Bahia Asuncion.

I have a feeling that it will be a great trip with great people.

Don't be negative it is only fishing.

[easyday]

I think it is sad that you got mostly negative replies.

I think you want more camaraderie but some people will just not open their hearts for that for some reason.

Many just want to stay to themselves.

I am happy that Makobob has organized some Mexican trips and I will be going with a small groups of guys to Bahia Asuncion.

I have a feeling that it will be a great trip with great people.

Don't be negative it is only fishing.

Can't wait for the Mexico trips:D

[monkeyfishturds]

Thanks for using one of your 29 post in the last 4 years on this...

:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Ouch, that wasn't friendly. Some opinions are not welcome i see.

[maui jim]

Hunting season cant use a kayak for that....... I think I may need to borrow Jeorges SKUNK OFF SPRAY.... Stupid deer, pigs, quail,

Too bad you cant eat ground squirrels cuz I knocked the beejesus out of those....400+ with a 17HMR..

I need to go hooping now....so I can post shorts.. they way my season is going...:cool:

[WahooUSMA]

Thanks for using one of your 29 post in the last 4 years on this...

:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

X-2

[Baja_Traveler]

I've been around long enough to notice that it all goes in cycles - when the fishing is dead, the forum is dead because there is not much to talk or brag about.

Then the fishing gets hot and we get lots of reports here.

Then the really dedicated guys who are out there putting in the miles get P.O.ed when they post up a report and the whole world descends on the location the next day - so they stop posting reports.

Then someone invariably whines that there are no reports being posted here and we're all dicks for ignoring the newbies. :D

Right now fishing isn't so hot, football and hunting season is upon us, and from what I read the lobster season isn't much to speak of this year.

Personally I haven't been on the water in two months because of my rifle competitions and getting a few hunts in - which seems to be my first love because I'm choosing it over my fishing poles.

But there is one thing I do know for a fact - there is a select group of guys here who are quietly putting in the time on the water every day, and probably catching more fish than I'll ever see because they are as dedicated to kayak fishing as I am to my rifle competitions. And I admire them for that - you guys know who you are...

[Chuck D]

I feel that as in life as well as in BWE you should give at least double back that you receive to make up for all the stingy ones in our world. However, this does not have to take the form of posting your catch or honey holes every time you go out. Over the years I have gotten many tips and given many tips from people/friends I have met through this forum. I have made many contacts and got much advise and help from people and try help them back whether it is in the form of a helpful post, pm, on the water experience or handing out fish to friends in need. I think most kayak fishermen are alike in the ways that they are kind, intelligent, competitive and environmentally concious people. I think your frustrations come from the fact that most people are not contributing in the form of posts and this equals the fact that people aren't contributing at all to the progression of kayak fishing, but I think it goes much deeper to the contributions outside of the forum that start in the forum, if that makes sense:o We are all is the same boat here my friends, just in different part of the country.

[PAL]

I agree to some aspects. The crowds do not seem to participate any longer. But why is that. Is the question.

Someone said over crowding, not sure if anyone is familiar with the BAY area but pretty damn populated and overcrowded and they seem to share just fine.



There are more people ever out kayak fishing. It is a mistake to equate lower web forum participation with a slump in the sport. Forum traffic seems to be down across the state, not just in SoCal.

Bay area! The intensity of use is nothing like it is at La Jolla or even Dana Pt. That cold, rough water might be NCKA's best advantage. It's a compelling reason to avoid solo missions, and keeps participation down to only the committed.

When it comes to community, forums are places to talk between events and other issues that bring people who share a common interest together, whether it is a tournament series or a cherished friend's battle against cancer. That's real community, not this Internet chit-chatter.

Even though the SoCal tournament scene was in decline at the time, this community rallied strong during the MLPA fight. All of La Jolla would have been closed. That is a fact. And leave that other guy out of it. You have little idea what you're talking about.

There should be comradery among all of us not hatred and regret that's how it almost feels. Paul you know how that feels when you go to a NCKA event everyone is family and that's how it should be down here.

Every family has its problem children, even NCKA. Try a positive attitude. You might get more positive responses. Camaraderie is around if you know where to look.

[Raskal311]

So who wants to hit NP with me tomorrow. I expect to catch nothing but bait fish and come home tired and happy. :D

[rhyak]

And leave that other guy out of it. You have little idea what you're talking about. Fair enough I know there was more too it then what was made public.

There are more people ever out kayak fishing. It is a mistake to equate lower web forum participation with a slump in the sport. Forum traffic seems to be down across the state, not just in SoCal.When it comes to community, forums are places to talk between events and other issues that bring people who share a common interest together, whether it is a tournament series or a cherished friend's battle against cancer. That's real community, not this Internet chit-chatter.

Even though the SoCal tournament scene was in decline at the time, this community rallied strong during the MLPA fight. All of La Jolla would have been closed.


Agree with you a lot more would have been lost.





I think we have lost the question here of why guys do not post reports? Even if it was a day on the water pulling up rockfish, yeah I know we have all seen them. But a good write up and report is always enjoyable to read.

[kareem korn]

Is this a fish report?

[ful-rac]

Well ryan I guess I can speak for myself....I usually fish at least once per week, and I don't catch fish every time. It might seem like I'm holding back...but the reality of it is that I don't catch fish every time. If I posted up a fish report of every single trip I take....you guys would probably puke all over your keyboards...

Who wants to hear...went out caught some bait, went on a 8 hour long dead halibut drift....caught 3 sanddabs and 8 lizardfish... who knows?....maybe that's entertaining for some...?

Our lobster cookout was more entertaining than the fishing we did that day...even though we ended up catching some fish...

Hopefully things will get better fishing-wise and good reports can start rolling out again...hey it's almost trout season! We'll have some good Irvine lake camp'n/trout reports soon. Maybe you can join us this year ryan!

[rhyak]

What is it you expect to gain personally with regard to whether or not this forum is blowing up?


Will not gain a thing personally, and do not expect to gain a thing.


I don't intend to offend you with this but lets be honest; in 18 months you've only posted an average of 4.67 times per month. You're not exactly super "active" around here.

Your right, but as other said, I drink Dos X...:cheers1::cheers1::cheers1:

Guys so everyone is clear, I am not bashing anyone and not trying to gain a thing what could I possibly gain by this, why does everyone worry about what others will gain from something else. I feel like I am pretty selfless when it comes to this sport, and why I asked the question to start with. Trying to get positive feedback but not finding much.

Hope I get a chance to meet all of you some day on the water. We can share stories and a good time.

Ryan

[rhyak]

Hopefully things will get better fishing-wise and good reports can start rolling out again...hey it's almost trout season! We'll have some good Irvine lake camp'n/trout reports soon. Maybe you can join us this year ryan!


Tony, let me know and I can try and make it. Think they just started the stocking, Double up Trout and Cats right now I am sure.

Would love to chill with you guys again.

Ryan

[lamb]

When I see even Chuck D chippin’ in on the subject, I can’t ignore it any more… :D

With the exception of some of you guys going at each other, lots of good stuff has been said.

Be rest assured, all lot of us have been having this conversation. It has been puzzling me for a long time… And I am still trying to figure it out.

There is something to be said about the fact it all pretty much started here in SoCal. I hope it’s not the sign of things to come for other parts of the country.

There is something to be said about general SoCal attitude – my spot, my paddy, my bite, my wave… Especially the general hostile attitude towards each other of SoCal fisherman… Ugh... “F’k you” screamed out from the top of your lungs is the most common communication exchange you can hear on the water between the two fishing boats… :rolleyes: ...after ignoring each other, that’s probably the most common one.

In March this year, we went down to Florida, KFS was sponsoring Jacksonville Kayak Fishing Classic. It was pouring for days, we’re talking some serious rain… Windows were 25 knots… 400+ people showed up for the tournament. :eek: I could not believe my eyes. Buncha’ awesome folks, great kayak fishing community they’ve got down in Jax.

In August, we went up to NorCal for Albion Open. It was the coolest event with the nicest people I’ve ever been to. Everyone having a blast, the whole camp site pretty much exclusively occupied by kayak fishermen attending the event and their families, good times 24 x 7 for 3 days… :cheers1:

Needless to say – I can wait to go back to both events next year.

It is very true that the internet is evolving, and so is everything that’s riding on it. No one has control over that. Look at the forums 10+ years ago, waaay before FB. The Web provided new platform for folks that share any common interest, People jumped on board to socialize and exchange info, help each other out, and help become better in whatever they were into. What a great concept...

Bragging has always been a big part of fishing. Lots of folks just couldn't resist to utilize this wonderful platform to let the world know about their awesome catch, get some recognition and establish the name for themselves. Oh, the web 1.0 generation…

But you can only brag so much… and very few people get into the sport exclusively for bragging. It’s the personal joy and satisfaction that turns each one of us into anything we do… Personal and internet are kind of ambiguous terms these days, aren't they?

Generational turnover is another phenomena. Folks come and go. Especially with kayak fishing – the turnover is pretty high. Say what you will but it is pretty demanding sport, and only a small percentage of even fisherman will dig and be cool with all the extra effort and obstacles that are required if you were going to do it on a piece of plastics. Do not overlook that part. Many kayakers that either started fishing on the power boat, or got one after experiencing kayak fishing, will tell you that. I am talking about that chill in your bones you get when NW wind is 10+ in December and your arms are wet from a friggen water that keeps dripping down your paddle… or that water that made it down inside of your splash jacket when you picked up that wave in your face during the launch 4 AM, and made the shirt on your belly all wet. :(

Then there are personal situations, life events that all of us get hit up with without warning, that simply put any “extra-curriculum” activities such as fishing or visiting fishing forum on hold. Health problems, family problems, job troubles.... I’ve personally had a number of those over the years that would make me skip out of even checking BWE for weeks!!!… and I even “work” here! :o

And sure, there’s lame arse attitude that some people bring to public forums. All of us admins and mods have been continually struggling with that for years. While we’re trying NOT to moderate too heavily (as most of you know there are times where you feel every 2nd response on a given thread should be nuked :D)… Luckilly, at least in BWE case that is still alive after all these years, there is enough cool folks that the general vibe that prevails is still a positive one. And all of us that struggle to find the time to run this thing find enough justification to help keep it going.

I agree 100% with what Paul said. The saddest thing we have right now is the collapse of the SoCal kayak fishing tournament scene. :( I’ve had enough conversations with people that are into the sport and in the industry, that are equally bummed about this fact, that I’m really hopeful that we will all come together and change that around in 2014.

Stay tuned!

[rhyak]

Well Put... :notworthy:

[Raskal311]

I can't agree with Lamb more! the only thing i'd like to add is there are very few of those My My My people here but the problem is they are the loudest. Quick to jump on newbs with those put your time on the water and figure it out remarks... Huge turn off in terms of wanting to participate more.

[GregAndrew]

There are a lot of contributing factors why forums in this area have gone the way that they have gone. Many of these factors have been mentioned or touched upon already (some overly simplified though). A couple not mentioned are the target species and fishing area. While Bass and Rockfish fishermen are not as inclined to hold back their report, most in southern Ca. target exotics (Halibut, Yellowtail and WSB). The big difference with these types of fish, is that they tend to show up in groups in certain areas for a limited time and then are gone until the next time. I can completely understand not wanting to fish among a throng of other fishermen. Or even allow your closest friends to do the same after you have discovered a time/location bite. Sharing a bite like that with a few thousand members of a group of dedicated fishermen (like BWE), would not allow you or them that luxury.

You really cannot compare the SoCal bight to the Central or North coast as far as fishing area. Except when the Squid are around (which has been a lot the last couple years) most of our coast is pretty much desert. Taking out the MLPA areas and the less accessible areas (below Doheny to Oceanside) also greatly reduces our fishable area. A photo, showing any land mass, posted from just about any location in SoCal will be recognized by at least 20% of the viewers of regional forums. Not to mention stacking up the fishermen again.

While I do not advocate posting or holding back a bite, I can understand why some may want to do either. And I support the right of the individual to choose for themselves without being bullied into it. Although, I will usually ask the guy that turned me on to a bite if they want me to hold my post. And, let me clarify to some here, a picture of a fish without mentioning other bites, fish lost or other peoples catches is not posting a "bite". Although, it does become a "bite" when you attack the poster. Seems these large forums have become just a place you get your setup and technique info squared away. And make your initial acquaintances that you build into speed dial relationships.

[Drake]

I have first hand seen the impact one fishing report has on a bite. Last winter, a few members of Lollipop and I had two weeks worth of a steady bite all to ourselves. Not a single boater/kayaker out there. One morning a brave young new guy found us on the beach and we let him tag a long. We put him on a few nice fish which were on the internet 5 hours later.

For the next month, you could walk from vessel to vessel in La Jolla. Fish were just haphazardly gaffed and tossed over the rails. I saw the same anglers day after day slaughtering more fish than could fit in a single freezer.

It's not about competition. Whether there is one kayak or one hundred, those who catch fish will continue to catch fish. It's about preservation of an ecosystem. Nothing will destroy La Jolla faster than the internet. People worry about Japanese radiation impacting our fish? People should worry more about Fishdope.

Do you ever watch the offshore numbers? 1000s of fish killed everyday, more than anyone really needs out of one trip.

Since then, I have become strictly CnR on all La Jolla and offshore Yellowtail with the exclusion of the ones I shoot. I also will not take more than 4 WSB a year.

I have no problem posting stories and pictures to get people motivated. But they will never be timely reports. A lot of work goes into finding bites. Why should a forum watcher who only fishes when a wide open bite hits the forums benefit from our hard work? You can't even grasp the amount of hours and milage that Dannowar, Daemon and I put on our peddles over the summer fishing Crystal Pier working the area, finding the patterns, and finally making a big score. Over eighty hours a week for the months of June and July. La Jolla was getting crowded, fish we getting pressured and we wanted to try something new. Nine miles round trip 5 days a week, from 3pm-2am working the same grounds. Dedication and preservierance got us those fish, not a hot tip off the internet.

This isn't to say we are greedy, self contained assholes. We share this info with plenty of people via text, pm and phone calls. They are the people that have shown they work hard in their own right and share accordingly in return. Call us a clique, call us a gang, call us assholes if you will, but if you ever see us on the water you can bet your ass we will show every new guy how to make bait, tie some knots, give some tackle and we've even been known to pass a rod off while bendo. Robfish gaffed todd ones first Sheepshead and never met the guy, Gregandrew gave me a sabiki my first day in LJ, Steveo put me on my first WSB, I got Stinkymatt his PB YT...the list goes on. Point being, the real community is out on their kayaks, not on their keyboards.

[Pocoloco]

Hunting season cant use a kayak for that....... I think I may need to borrow Jeorges SKUNK OFF SPRAY.... Stupid deer, pigs, quail,

Too bad you cant eat ground squirrels cuz I knocked the beejesus out of those....400+ with a 17HMR..

I need to go hooping now....so I can post shorts.. they way my season is going...:cool:
ITS DUCK SEASON. I hunt ducks outa my yak. Sorry no pics or gps numbers

[lamb]

More good stuff... :cheers1:

It is good that this is being discussed, in a healthy and respectful way, so we all can better understand each other's perspective. You will NOT feel the same about public fishing forum if you're out there OTW (on-the-water, for those of you who wonder :)) a couple of times a week, once a month, or once in a blue moon... Fishing guide, hard core or recreational angler, or a guy who is fishing for living WILL NOT have the same feeling on this subject...

But you have to realize that public forum is still a great place to learn, great place to share your experience, and learn from other people's feedback... It's a place where you can make friends for life! I know I've made many, and I will be the first one to tell you that I learned a ton from it! And not only about fishing! :D

For the most part, you can kind of get to know the person behind the keyboard based on their posts. We all are who we are, offline or online. The important part about BWE is it IS a SoCal kayak fishing community gathering place, one of. Knowing how hard it is to rally people around any common cause, we have to nurture it. It comes in handy to all of us - it has in the past, I am sure it will in the future.

Not to mention the entertaining factor... :D

And yes, like lots of other subjects, this one has popped up at least 4-5 times that I recall over the years.

Neill...
You've come a long way.
Just in case you've overlooked it, here is a link to the same discussion back 5.5 years ago, lil' before you got BWE account. I am stoked to see BWE still going strong!

Many of the core BWE gang that you hardly ever hear from these days chipped in on it on this thread, so it's worth reading for the new folks. Besides, it's got Todd's legendary "Evolution Of Kayak Fishermen" theses, that is so very true for so many of us.... 0

http://www.bigwatersedge.com/bwevb/showthread.php?t=3020&highlight=evolution+kayak+fisherman

And BTW, Team Sewer, FYI - Todd (C-Level) was that boater that one crazy halibut bite day who was watching you guys pull one flat kind after another right by his boat on anchor... where he smiled, congratulated, and celebrated with you (yes, they had like 8 on ice as well)... Not yelled "YOU ARE TOO CLOSE!!!" like 90% of SoCal boaters would... :) Once a kayak fisherman, always a kayak fisherman.

Another plug for Todd - awesome read for anyone wanting to know more about halibut fishing from Jim's site

http://kayak4fish.com/press/Halibut0405.shtml

[PAL]

More good stuff... :cheers1:
Just in case you've overlooked it, here is a link to the same discussion back 5.5 years ago, lil' before you got BWE account. I am stoked to see BWE still going strong!

Many of the core BWE gang that you hardly ever hear from these days chipped in on it on this thread, so it's worth reading for the new folks. Besides, it's got Todd's legendary "Evolution Of Kayak Fishermen" theses, that is so very true for so many of us.... 0

http://www.bigwatersedge.com/bwevb/showthread.php?t=3020&highlight=evolution+kayak+fisherman


That's a C-Level classic, but I thought you implied we'd see posts from the old guard. I guess some of us are really, really old timers. Those names date from BWE generation 2 or 3. Still fun to see.

[jorluivil]

#5 for me. Disappoint with some of members that I met in the water and they try to avoid you.don't want to mention names but, there part of some sewish spill team.

Thank God our name rhymes with lure and not sewish because we would never do such a thing.:D

[jorluivil]

Oh I sorry you are "disappoint" with the "sewish spill team", I'm assuming your referring to team sewer?

Have you ever introduced yourself to anyone of us? I don't ever remember ever meeting you.

Stinkymatt runs the complaint department maybe you want to get ahold of him hopefully he can resolve your issue.


In all seriousness were all really cool guys...at least I like to think so. If anyone is unlucky enough to run into any of us on the water don't be afraid to introduce yourself....we won't bite....



HARD!


I'm with Tony on this one, if I had to post a thread everytime I went out fishing most of you would be disappointed:(

However, I did manage to come home with enough macs to cover my hooping sessions for the rest of the season

[lamb]

You've got to go to yakfishing.com for the old old guard Paul... :D

Keep in mind - BWE dates back prior to what you see on the oldest posts here, to 2002... remember, we got hacked way back and they nuked the database... And there was no backup :eek:... No, I was not in charge of backups at the time :D

We've got yakfishing.com forum backup - we'll bring it online soon. If nothign else, just for the kicks. :D

[PAL]

You've got to go to yakfishing.com for the old old guard Paul... :D

Keep in mind - BWE dates back prior to what you see on the oldest posts here, to 2002... remember, we got hacked way back and they nuked the database... And there was no backup :eek:... No, I was not in charge of backups at the time :D

We've got yakfishing.com forum backup - we'll bring it online soon. If nothign else, just for the kicks. :D

Wow, web 1.0 right there. Yakfishing.com should be in a museum. I'll study it too, if it goes back far enough. It's a kayak fishing time capsule. Thanks Adi!

[Cbad Mike]

Lots of great input from everyone.

My personal thought on the subject of fish reports.

If you want an up to date fish report GO FISHING! Get out on the water and make friends!
You want to know where I caught fish the day before? Then meet me at the launch at 5 am, say hello and introduce yourself. I'll be more than happy to paddle out with you and show you where and how I was successful the day before.

I don't usually post timely fish reports on BWE for the following reasons.

1. If you were really interested in catching fish you would be on the water regularly and therefore wouldn't need a report.

2. From putting my time in otw (a lot of time) I've met some really cool people and we share information because we all know that each of us works hard to find the fish. I don't think it would be fair to share info that was given to me from someone else's hard work. If you want a report than deserve a report, Help other people and make friends! Kayak fishing isn't Obama Care or Welfare... you don't get rewarded for doing nothing.

3. I get skunked more times in a month then most people on BWE fish in a year so frankly I feel that I deserve to enjoy those days when the fish are jumping in my kayak more than someone who only blows the dust off of their kayak when it's sunny with no swell and 79 degrees out.

4. Why in the hell would I post a great day on the water for all of the power boaters to read? If you don't know why that's a bad thing then your not on the water enough.

5. There are no fish in La Jolla. :D

I'm not trying to sound like a dick it's just how I honestly feel and I think a lot of other anglers feel the same way. Is it really that hard to understand?

[Deamon]

I've been fishing less by myself these days because of BWE. Fishing alone or with a buddy has always been my preference for years.There's just nothing like putting in the time and figuring stuff out whether alone or with a great friend. Like anywhere, there's a mixed crowd in the yak world. Some throw you stink eye...cool. Some are friendly, chat then go their own way...cool. Some are connected to groups...can be very, very cool.

Hanging with the Sewer team or the Lollipop crew isn't like were all tight with each other all the time and that's it. We've all got our own worlds we're living in. Family's, jobs, blah, blah, blah. Guys move in and out as they prefer or as their schedules allow. Yeah, there are text's between ourselves outside of the BWE forum, especially if there's a bite going on :cool: but more than half the time it's not about yak fishing at all. I think those who try to disparage a Team Sewer or Lollipop might be missing out...;)

BWE lurkers...:the_finger:
Fresh reports so the rest of us can take a break and enjoy your day...:notworthy:
Posting photos of big fish and not giving out too much info...:D
Tournaments and extreme competition, not my thing...:spam:
BWE...:cheers1:
Jim

[Jimmyz123]

Post a report or don't post a report no one should feel that they have to, or feel bad if they have. I fully understand that there is usually a delay on many of the big fish reports for protection of the bite that may be going on and again that is fully the right of those posting.

Is there anything wrong with any of that? No.

As others have mentioned the newby reports that happen about your first 20 times out of the same 12 to 18 inch sandy, spotty, or what have you does get boring after times. Now, reports that have photos, and videos are more interesting to check out, but again if you are expecting to get GPS readings, and locations out of the posts, you're crazy. Nothing personal to that, but it's just how people roll.

I think we all can agree that we love this sport of Kayak fishing and we all love to pop in and check things out see who's doing what, and go on about our lives. I've learned a lot from many of the vets on this site, and one of the biggest things I've learned is sometimes it's better to not be heard and to learn to let things roll off your back. Don't take things too personal.

Great site, great group of guys, and I look forward to seeing you all out on the water.

[Fiskadoro]

I like to think I single handedly ruined Kayak fishing, at least that's what the Malibu tough guys told me. I'd post reports but then someone would have to kill me :D

[Fiskadoro]

B.S. aside.... times change. I can't think of a single board that has the participation levels it had half a decade ago. Look at Allcoast or even BD. Actually this is the only board where I still still see a solid level of quality participation.

I think the Golden age of fishing reports is pretty much gone. People over time relized that if you posted too much bite info online it just lead to too many people fishing your favorite spots. I still put up a report now and then but only when I feel that it wont have a negative impact on the local fishing.

I think reports should encourage others to go fish in general, not give them specifics like when, where, or things like "GO THERE NOW!!! every time someone catches a fish.

[TJones]

guys attacking each other again , pointing the finger at the sewer . come on . and you wonder why nobody wants to post . great topic with lots of feedback . i will stay out of this since , i am the new guy .

[jorluivil]

If anyone has a complaint about Team Sewer please contact Stinkymatt, he handles our complaint department.

[wiredantz]

I complain so much to Matt, all he does is say.. .

TODAY IS GOING TO BE THE BEST FISHING DAY EVER......

have a i heard that one a dozen times.

[Deamon]

StinkyMatt...there you go...he's proof that you don't have to be a great fisherman to be a part of a group...

Matt IS very good at getting Sewer's "proven producers" to fork over their lobsters and cheesecakes so he and other outsiders can enjoy them...:D

[makobob]

So Stinky makes the big bucks cause he can handle the Sewer? You guys keep on hanging in there! And please keep posting the good times.

[ericko]

Remember Matt is the ELITE fishermen of the groug...heheh hohoho omg and the other guy that hangs with the sewer crew he's a three time three time three time world champion in what ask ful rac.. best part of all of this is its friday and tomorowow some of us lucky ones will be fishing and not wondering who,what,when or were to fish...

So boys what time are we headed out?

[maui jim]

Even the Three Stoogies had a leader.... Moe...:D
:cool:

[kluts]

I see many of you guys from down here have seen the overcrowding explode due to internet exposure, and are doing your best to curb the damage, and I salute you for that.Like Pal said;there just isnt a lot of very productive spots left anymore due to the closures,and the ones that are good get crowded very quickly.My question is,Why do some of you guys feel it is alright to blow up a bite any way,with total disregaurd for the locals?Is it because,you think your doing the lazy man a favor just sitting on his couch?and you will be a hero for it?or is it because you live hours away, you got your fish and wont be back till next year,or ,maybe you had a personal problem with someone and your on a quest to send everyone to crowd that spot? whatever the reason I see most of you say one thing about your secret bite then go expose another,So,what is your determining factor,shut up about this one bite then go expose the other bite?

[wiredantz]

I see many of you guys from down here have seen the overcrowding explode due to internet exposure, and are doing your best to curb the damage, and I salute you for that.Like Pal said;there just isnt a lot of very productive spots left anymore due to the closures,and the ones that are good get crowded very quickly.My question is,Why do some of you guys feel it is alright to blow up a bite any way,with total disregaurd for the locals?Is it because,you think your doing the lazy man a favor just sitting on his couch?and you will be a hero for it?or is it because you live hours away, you got your fish and wont be back till next year,or ,maybe you had a personal problem with someone and your on a quest to send everyone to crowd that spot? whatever the reason I see most of you say one thing about your secret bite then go expose another,So,what is your determining factor,shut up about this one bite then go expose the other bite?

that is really negative...

positive note.... People like to share :D

[jorluivil]

If I was a mod I know What I'd be doing right about now.

[kluts]

that is really negative...

positive note.... People like to share :D
Nothing negative about it at all,just wondering what motivates people to go silent about one bite but not another and obviously people dont like to share,or there would be a lot more posting,,maybe you can understand that now,but I doubt it

[makobob]

Nothing negative about it at all,just wondering what motivates people to go silent about one bite but not another and obviously people dont like to share,or there would be a lot more posting,,maybe you can understand that now,but I doubt it

Sure some people like to share, come and join one of our Baja or Bust trips, and see what sharing is all about. EVERYONE is welcome.

[Drake]

Nothing negative about it at all,just wondering what motivates people to go silent about one bite but not another and obviously people dont like to share,or there would be a lot more posting,,maybe you can understand that now,but I doubt it

I think people are misconstrued as what constitutes a "Bite"

The stray Yellow Tail which get picked up here and there and make it to the forums isn't a "bite." There are YT in La Jolla all year long and they're bound to get caught between wide open bites.

A "bite" means load up your cooler with ice, make room in your freezer and bring one rod because that's all you're going to need to leave with limits. We had a few like that this year and to be honest most of them were kept on the hush within a very small circle.

Often times, when the squid bites blow up in LJ isn't because it gets posted on the internet. It's mainly because you can't launch from the shores and NOT paddle past the boats and kayaks sitting on the squid grounds. Most of the time people stop and say

"Uhhh Hey....whats going on in here."

They didn't even know squid existed. I didn't my first time I fished there.
Next day, they come back with squid jigs and dropper loops. They call their new buddies they just met, tell them and then post it on the web because they're super stoked. Usually someone will nudge that lucky angler to keep from posting on the internet for a few days to keep the pressure off.

The WSB came through LJ in the Spring and for four days there was only two skiffs, three kayaks, a few divers and one PB on that bite then it was over. It was limits for everyone but that bite never saw the web because all the guys out there knew the impact it would have on the fishery. A few weeks later, most of us posted our stories and our fish.

There's always that occasional "Well the Cats out of the bag" post when someone decides to blow up a bite under the assumption it's already known and usually that's true.

Policing other individuals right to post is not only constitutionally wrong but just a dickish thing to do. The best this would be to educate and encourage those who wish to post to use discretion when and what information they post. Not because it protects the locals, or the guys who work hard to find the fish themselves... but because if they want LJ to stay open and they care to see home guards here year after year they will be mindful of the impact 200+ baited lines in the water will do the population. No need to bully people in a corner and threaten them if they post.

It's very important for new guys to make small circles of friends like Lollipop, Sewer, RedSled, TackticalCrew, Jurassic..... not saying they need to make team names and all that nonsense, just get a small group of like minded individuals who want to excel at this sport and can help eachother out without relying on the internet to put fish in their laps.

That's my .02 :bigear:

[kluts]

Well said.

[jorluivil]

I see many of you guys from down here have seen the overcrowding explode due to internet exposure, and are doing your best to curb the damage, and I salute you for that.Like Pal said;there just isnt a lot of very productive spots left anymore due to the closures,and the ones that are good get crowded very quickly.My question is,Why do some of you guys feel it is alright to blow up a bite any way,with total disregaurd for the locals?Is it because,you think your doing the lazy man a favor just sitting on his couch?and you will be a hero for it?or is it because you live hours away, you got your fish and wont be back till next year,or ,maybe you had a personal problem with someone and your on a quest to send everyone to crowd that spot? whatever the reason I see most of you say one thing about your secret bite then go expose another,So,what is your determining factor,shut up about this one bite then go expose the other bite?


What's considered a local?

If a local invites me to a wide open bite and then goes and post up a report of all the fish we caught the next day does that make it OK?

We fished LJ a few months ago, everyone was crowded in an area south of me, I was literally fishing alone away from the crowds. I had a double YT hook up and when I landed one of the two YT everyone came my way. Should I have kicked them out of my spot or moved away and let the 'locals' have it?

I could care less how it comes to you but do you literally find your own hot bite Or does someone tell you about it?

Why do some feel the need to share a bite? Because they can.

How many 'hot bites' have there been up and down the coast(SD to Ventura) this year? How many of those were posted on BWE? I know of one local bite that went on for at least two weeks, not a word was posted on BWE or Bloodydecks but the area was as crowded as Walmart on Black Friday. Gee, I wondered how they all found out about it.


You don't need to post a hot bite or a any bite on any website. All you need to do is make a phone call or send a text. I posted these numbers once before but I'll do it again.

4 yakkers text 4 yakkers about a hote bite
4 yakkers each text another 4 yakkers (16 yakkers now know about the bite)
16 kayakers each text another 4 yakkers(64 yakkers now know about the bite)
256 yakkers each text another 4 yakkers(256 yakkers now know about the bite)

you see where this is going?

[Drake]

you see where this is going?

1024 kayakers?

[jorluivil]

1024 kayakers?

BAHAHAHAHAHA!!!


I love this place!

[Drake]

BAHAHAHAHAHA!!!


I love this place!

This place loves you too. However, your math is off.

If 4 know, and tell 4 people. 16 NEW yakkers know, plus the 4 that told them. So, 20 know about the bite.

Those 16 NEW tell 4 each, so now 64 NEW Kayakers know, plus the original 16+4 so we are at 84.
Those 64 NEW tell 4 more people each, so 320 NEW people now know, plus the original 84. So 404...

If we're going to put it on the internet let's at least make it accurate :cool: <3

[makobob]

Darn, we sure do have a lot of yakers out here, it's a wonder there are any fish left.

[jorluivil]

This place loves you too. However, your math is off.

If 4 know, and tell 4 people. 16 NEW yakkers know, plus the 4 that told them. So, 20 know about the bite.

Those 16 NEW tell 4 each, so now 64 NEW Kayakers know, plus the original 16+4 so we are at 84.
Those 64 NEW tell 4 more people each, so 320 NEW people now know, plus the original 84. So 404...

If we're going to put it on the internet let's at least make it accurate :cool: <3


If 1 tells 4 its 1 + 4 = 5
if 5 tell 4 each its 5 x 4 = 20 + 5 = 25
if 25 tell 4 each its 25 x 4 = 100 + 25 = 125
if 125 tell 4 each its 125 x 4 = 500 + 125 = 625

[Drake]

If 1 tells 4 its 1 + 4 = 5
if 5 tell 4 each its 5 x 4 = 20 + 5 = 25
if 25 tell 4 each its 25 x 4 = 100 + 25 = 125
if 125 tell 4 each its 125 x 4 = 500 + 125 = 625

That's a linear equation. Your first example was exponential.

[ful-rac]

That's a linear equation. Your first example was exponential.

Thanks for clearing that up professor!

[jorluivil]

That's a linear equation. Your first example was exponential.




<a href="<iframe width=" 420"="" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/zZ3fjQa5Hls" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen="">"><a href="<iframe width=" 420"="" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/zZ3fjQa5Hls" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen=""><iframe src="//www.youtube.com/embed/zZ3fjQa5Hls" allowfullscreen="" frameborder="0" height="315" width="420"></iframe>

[Drake]

I love you

Now can we get back to the meat of this thread?
Get off my fish everyone. I claim them as my own

[Margarita Mike]

Some of us are just to damn old anymore. Hell, Its getting hard to remember my pass word. :)

[makobob]

Some of us are just to damn old anymore. Hell, Its getting hard to remember my pass word. :)

xxxx, OR WAS IT XXXXX? Now I remember it was Baja or Bust!

[Aaron&Julie]

X3 What wiredantz and PAL said.

Sometimes it feels like we're the only ones posting a timely report (within 1-3 days) anymore even when we don't score.
The degree to which we post has gone down due to personal factors that have seen us go only 4 times in the last year and a half and that was within these last 3 months. 3 out of 4 trips were reported we believe.

We agree with wiredantz and PAL on the main issues they pointed out, especially the code groups. Think about it, there are some top notch guides who do get people on fish. If reports were posted right away by the guides or customers, when they scored all of those yellows and whites it could only hurt their business for the next few days, as every PBer and kayaker would hit the water and take over the area. The customers still post, but from what we've seen typically it's well after a bite, weeks and months at times. Sure, they'll give kudos to their guide, but it sure doesn't help another kayaker out.

We go when we can go, and we almost always post a detailed report ASAP, without leaving anything out. Sure, it would be great to know that a bite's going on, just don't count on finding one a SoCal kayak fishing website.

We could give a flying Wallenda why others have their reasons for not posting timely reports. But if you see one from us, you might give the lengthy report a glance that it might help you soon after ;)

[jorluivil]

X3 What wiredantz and PAL said.

Sometimes it feels like we're the only ones posting a timely report (within 1-3 days) anymore even when we don't score.
The degree to which we post has gone down due to personal factors that have seen us go only 4 times in the last year and a half and that was within these last 3 months. 3 out of 4 trips were reported we believe.

We agree with wiredantz and PAL on the main issues they pointed out, especially the code groups. Think about it, there are some top notch guides who do get people on fish. If reports were posted right away by the guides or customers, when they scored all of those yellows and whites it could only hurt their business for the next few days, as every PBer and kayaker would hit the water and take over the area. The customers still post, but from what we've seen typically it's well after a bite, weeks and months at times. Sure, they'll give kudos to their guide, but it sure doesn't help another kayaker out.

We go when we can go, and we almost always post a detailed report ASAP, without leaving anything out. Sure, it would be great to know that a bite's going on, just don't count on finding one a SoCal kayak fishing website.

We could give a flying Wallenda why others have their reasons for not posting timely reports. But if you see one from us, you might give the lengthy report a glance that it might help you soon after ;)


Well said :luxhello::luxhello::luxhello::luxhello::luxhello: :luxhello:

[Fiskadoro]

Think about it, there are some top notch guides who do get people on fish. If reports were posted right away by the guides or customers, when they scored all of those yellows and whites it could only hurt their business for the next few days, as every PBer and kayaker would hit the water and take over the area.... We could give a flying Wallenda why others have their reasons for not posting timely reports. But if you see one from us, you might give the lengthy report a glance that it might help you soon after ;)

If it was just about guides it would be one thing, that makes sense, but that is not only what it's about.

What get's me about the whole report thing is the double standards and how some have used this issue to attack others they simply do not like for one reason or another, and in the process kind of ruined it for everyone.

Some can post anything they want and another says something like "Seabass are in the kelp in the spring before they spawn... go get them!" and same people act like it's the end of the world.

Bashing people for sharing info become a way to put down newbies or enforce the somewhat highschoolish clique mentality. Newbies come in get excited about the new sport and want to post and share and then they get shot down.

The people behind this stuff are pretty obvious, and their posts clearly show their motivations.

5, 10, 15 posts 20 posts in five or six years all either attacking those who do share info or telling others that they should never post any info online. The question is if they are so against helping others why are they even here in the first place.

Some of these guys are long time members of the kayak community. I'd say it's about them flexing their muscles as the self proclaimed "Pioneers of Kayaking" while at the same time trying to block or deny access to anyone who brings new talent or even worse God forbid new ideas to the game.

For instance I remember the first time someone suggested that a thru hull transducer or one in the water might give better results then gluing one in your hull and a long time poster instantly came back and said: "All you need to kayak fish is a rod a rope and a gaff and the rest of this tech stuff is just total B.S. "

Years later in the age of Gopros and high tech Hummingbird finders that seems ridiculously comical but it was obviously about protecting what that poster saw as his status quot.


I think in the kayak community there are several factors that have come up that have kind of killed the report posting. Some are legitimate others are simply petty, but they have had significant impact,

The truth is there are reports that if posted will lead to overcrowding and overfishing and there are reports that don't lead to overcrowding and over fishing, and the good long time posters (blackcloud9 comes to mind) know the difference, and still post some great reports.

Unfortunately at the same time you have a segment of the community that wants to pretend that sharing any info or posting any report is bad. They don't share info. They do not want anyone else sharing info either.

The shame is rather then educating posters about what they can and should post these long time members of the community just want to shut everyone down for their own selfish reasons. That mentality has spread and as a result they've tainted the well for everyone.

[Siebler]

Hunting season cant use a kayak for that....... I think I may need to borrow Jeorges SKUNK OFF SPRAY.... Stupid deer, pigs, quail,




I think I use my kayaks more during hunting season than for fishing.....

[Siebler]

Some of us are just to damn old anymore. Hell, Its getting hard to remember my pass word. :)


You know its serious when you get mike away form his Hot Rods to post on a kayak fishing forum :cheers1:

Speaking of that Mike, Nicole is off till 12/7 so if you have any shows or anything let us know! Or if you go camp Jennings we will come and see you for a beer or something at least.

[Aaron&Julie]

If it was just about guides it would be one thing, that makes sense, but that is not only what it's about.

What get's me about the whole report thing is the double standards and how some have used this issue to attack others they simply do not like for one reason or another, and in the process kind of ruined it for everyone.

Bashing people for sharing info become a way to put down newbies or enforce the somewhat highschoolish clique mentality.....

You know that, we know that, and others too. Put once the food is spoiled there's not a whole lot you can do about it, it won't taste the same.

Not succumbing to peer pressure is difficult, no doubt most difficult to newbies. When an experienced 'yaker will show them the ropes so their learning curve shoots up, but is told to keep their success quiet to prevent an onslaught of others to ruin the fishing, what are they likely to do? They do have a choice: #1 join with the clique/experienced 'yaker or #2 say "screw it", I'll do as I please. Odds are 98% of them will go with #1. We're happy to be the 2%ers and do #2 (please no potty jokes) that still enjoy openly trying to help out everyone. We are happy to give feedback, when sharing information on the beach, on the internet and OTW, too. That is if you don't become a barnacle and cling to us where ever we go. Not many want that, that's one of the things guides are for, and one of the niceties of 'yaking on the ocean, some solitude. We've had some barnacles in years past, it was a bad as trying to shake a big "dog" from stealing all of your mackerel. Sure it's nice if you see rods bent in the distance or an experienced 'yaker out there and head in those directions. No one wants to miss a hot bite. Just be considerate enough not to follow them everywhere they go.

When we started this great sport 10 years ago, we received excellent beginners information through open communication on the websites we visited, mostly from the DPKFM website and guys like Quietman, Piranha and Yani. We received good info on this website as well, about fishing high and low with macks, and timely reports of fish being caught.

We never received a PM about a hot bite. We haven't modernized to fish finders or peddlers, yet. (Probably be bashed for mentioning that one). We put in our time, more time, more time, and still do. Our 4 trips in the last 3 months (only ones in 1.5 years) returned some good eating bottomfish, and a 23lb yellowtail. Not great, but it's time well spent, because we both love everything about kayak fishing, which includes helping out those just learning the game, openly and without discrimination. Some people just aren't with the program anymore on that last part. Eh, what are going to do #1 or #2?

[Drake]

This thread went from a very constructive discussion, to zeroing in on JUST Fish Reports. The topic of posting ish reports has been debated way too many times since I've become active on this forum. Why do we continue to talk about the same topic? It always ends in a closure. Have we learned nothing?

[Smthtnnr]

Wow this is one dead horse. I think the posting situation is good as it is, not too many people post reports so no hot bites are really given away, but there still are occasional reports that are helpful.

[Aaron&Julie]

Wow this is one dead horse. I think the posting situation is good as it is, not too many people post reports so no hot bites are really given away, but there still are occasional reports that are helpful.

You're probably the most correct on both your points. But as Adi implied there is a trend, a trend that is quite different than it was 10 years ago, for those that that have followed BWE religiously, and fished LJ for that long, and remember what it was like back then.

That trend is across the board on ALL SoCal kayak fishing websites. All you can do is just make the best what you can get, and put your time in.

[dbarnett66]

I spoke with some kayak guys about BWE on occasions when visiting the local lakes and they seemed disinterested because they spent the majority of time on freshwater. A couple of guys told me that BWE didn't really appeal to them. Could a dedicated freshwater forum be added to appeal to another sub-group of kayak angler? It could boost the membership and educate the others to transition to saltwater.

I am still trying to lose more weight before I get out past the breakers. Eventually I will get there.