Kayak Sonar Discussion

[chris138]

Hey Gang,

I feel like a lot of people have the same kinds of questions when it comes to sonar... Especially from those folks who have just recently got their first fish finder, or have upgraded or switched brands. In internet forums, you typically want to avoid having a bunch of different threads about the same topic. It makes it hard for people to go back and search for the info they need.

Some of you who have followed me for a while know that I like to offer sonar tips to fellow kayakers when I can. So I thought I would start my own sonar thread, and try to make it more of a centralized location for some of this info.

The format I envision is that people can ask some of their sonar questions here. I'll do my best to check in often, and answer the best I can. Other more experienced members should chime in and address whatever they want, or tear my theories to shreds if you want... I can take it don't worry (;

What the thread is NOT for: Put-downs or trolling others, arguing with others about which brand or product is better than another, online deals or people trying to sell their stuff. I use Lowrance, but I will not try to sell their stuff or try to convince you that it is better than another product. This should be the place for technical discussion and sonar theory.

I'll kick it off with a few sonar tips for beginners, and a few screen shots from my IG archives :yt::wsb:


1. Try to mount the transducer in the water. Yes, shooting through the hull works, especially if installed by experts like the guys at OEX. I've done it both ways with the same FF and trust me you are losing sensitivity and signal strength. I would go with a RAM boom arm over a through-hull install every time.

2. Use separate power supply for FF and bait tank. This is for obvious reasons, if one system goes down you don't lose the other device. An entry level sonar like an Elite 4x for example uses very little amperage without GPS. The pump will drain batteries fast, especially 12V. Learn how much juice you need for your setup, and size your batteries appropriately.

3. Stuff will corrode, and need to be repaired. Next time you're at OEX or west marine, buy a bunch of extra terminal connectors, heat shrink butt connectors, and wire. Have all that stuff with you at the launch so when your sonar doesn't turn on, you can repair it right then. Make your wiring easily accessible and give yourself extra slack in case you have to cut and reconnect.

Now the "plotter porn" :eek:

Kamakazi Yellowtail!

https://i.imgur.com/ut6ehsYl.jpg

Fatty Homeguard Dives on my Dropper.

https://i.imgur.com/sXOEWUNl.jpg

Slug Halibut Stacked Like Pancakes!

https://i.imgur.com/PfPbyM1l.png

Looks like WSB to me... what do you think?

https://i.imgur.com/pAdlIGJl.png

School of YT breezing through mid column, out on the periphery of the cone.

https://i.imgur.com/5XN8Wu7l.png

[Orca Winfrey]

Great info. Thanks. I'm still a noob when it comes to reading an FF.

[chris138]

Great info. Thanks. I'm still a noob when it comes to reading an FF.

Feel free to ask whatever you want. Even if you feel like a noob, I'm sure many others have the same questions and will appreciate you asking.

[summers in kuwait]

Chris,

First off, thanks. This type of input and support has made this forum a wealth of knowledge for many.

I can't speak for others, but I have no problem saying that using a fish finder has been one of the more challenging aspects in my fishing, as I spent my entire life fishing without one, until the last couple years.

I know many may like to know more info about this question:

"So I've gotten a ff and hooked it up, now how do I optimize the settings for fishing Inshore Saltwater?"

Cheers,

Todd

[Fishing619]

What is the difference on FF and sonar?
Or why do we need the two of them.

[chris138]

Chris,

First off, thanks. This type of input and support has made this forum a wealth of knowledge for many.

I can't speak for others, but I have no problem saying that using a fish finder has been one of the more challenging aspects in my fishing, as I spent my entire life fishing without one, until the last couple years.

I know many may like to know more info about this question:

"So I've gotten a ff and hooked it up, now how do I optimize the settings for fishing Inshore Saltwater?"

Cheers,

Todd

60' or less: you can play around with all different frequencies and see all kinds of cool structure and fish. low frequencies, you will see tons of huge boomerangs, and get a lot of non-sense returns of grass and smelt and ribbon kelp and all kinds of noise and weird stuff. use 200 kHz plus for shallow waters, and use downscan if you have it.

~60' deep or more: you want to be using your lowest frequency mainly. if you have a big enough screen, you can run dual frequency on one screen. But still the lower kHz the better. If you are just getting started, use only your low frequency. lower kHz has better penetration of depth, and seeing beneath hard marks like macks or crabs. it also typically will have a wider beam, which means you can see out to the side around you more. higher frequencies see better resolution of smaller or softer objects. so if you want to look at individual greenbacks, higher kHz is better. Low frequencies will give you the boomerangs and worms of big fish. turn up your sensitivity or gain until the bottom looks like a very "hot" or "hard" color (ie, the bottom looks like my pics above, in whatever color spectum you have)

Oh yea, did I mention that having color is pretty important?

EDIT: I should also add that you want to use the highest ping speed possible for fishing the deeper waters of LJ and inshore socal.

If you get that far, then take some screen shots and post them here. I will give you some feedback from there. :cheers1:

[chris138]

What is the difference on FF and sonar?
Or why do we need the two of them.

FF is a type of sonar. I use the two words interchangeably so as not to be so repetitive. I will also call it a "meter" or "sounder" sometimes... but its all the same essentially.

[slobound]

Tagging along to read. I previously had my transducer installed through hull with goop until I used my brother's yak w/FF (in water). The difference in clarity was AMAZING so I immediately changed mine. I haven't gotten to try it yet but excited to check out the difference.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Valek]

Thanks for the opening this sonar thread.
I am still figuring out my HDS gen3. and looking for more hints.
What is the model of your FF and what kind of transducer do you have?
Is there any other settings that you recommend beside low frequency for 200'/300' of water to find the structure?

[chris138]

Thanks for the opening this sonar thread.
I am still figuring out my HDS gen3. and looking for more hints.
What is the model of your FF and what kind of transducer do you have?
Is there any other settings that you recommend beside low frequency for 200'/300' of water to find the structure?

I have the Elite 7ti. Transducer is 83/200/455/800, not the total scan. If you are fishing deep structure over 200'+, you have to be using 83 or 50 kHz, or MID/LOW chirp. To see the bottom well you should turn up the gain. Then the top half of the water column will be "washed out" and have a bunch of feedback and noise.Either turn up the noise rejection and surface clarity, or zoom in on the bottom using the + and - keys. See how that works for you.

[King Saba]

Great info. Thanks. I'm still a noob when it comes to reading an FF.

You never ask me questions! Relying on me to interpret my FF all the time. Sheesh!

[Orca Winfrey]

You never ask me questions! Relying on me to interpret my FF all the time. Sheesh!

Lol! I'm working smarter, not harder.

[GTboosted]

Can you see fish in REALLY thick kelp the extends from the bottom to surface?

I normally have to adjust the sensitivity to where it almost shows nothing in thick kelp. Then I am not sure if I see fist or not. Lol

[chris138]

Can you see fish in REALLY thick kelp the extends from the bottom to surface?

I normally have to adjust the sensitivity to where it almost shows nothing in thick kelp. Then I am not sure if I see fist or not. Lol

Yes for sure you can. Sometimes the key with that is the color line. Play around with colorline until you get the kelp to mark really soft, then the fish or bait will stand out more. I also like downscan 455 kHz for this application, because you can see the individual kelp strands and a fish really sticks out.

If you can get the DS dialed in, then you can overlay it on top of your mid/high chirp... for a more advanced configuration.

[Dannowar]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170914/4449e91ca3f763c61b337b529259364f.jpg

DORADO. YOU'RE BITTTTTTT


https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170914/7dbcd06ca14c8e3453f9dd0f8efe715b.jpg

Open for interpretation....


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[chris138]

Definitely gratuitous sonar shots are welcome :cheers1:

Just be careful giving out your coordinates!;)

[PapaDave]

I have a Lowrance Elite 7 Chirp, an suggestions on settings? Can't seem to get it tuned in.

[Dirty Curti]

Thanks for the thread. I have a few images I would like to share and get your opinion on what you see. I didn't catch any fish during these meter reads.

http://i1187.photobucket.com/albums/z388/PostNetOceanside/20160417_114523_zpsqhmejaoc.jpg (http://s1187.photobucket.com/user/PostNetOceanside/media/20160417_114523_zpsqhmejaoc.jpg.html)



http://i1187.photobucket.com/albums/z388/PostNetOceanside/20160417_104524_zpsuwyldbhd.jpg (http://s1187.photobucket.com/user/PostNetOceanside/media/20160417_104524_zpsuwyldbhd.jpg.html)



http://i1187.photobucket.com/albums/z388/PostNetOceanside/20160417_124203_zpsxyaebfh1.jpg (http://s1187.photobucket.com/user/PostNetOceanside/media/20160417_124203_zpsxyaebfh1.jpg.html)



http://i1187.photobucket.com/albums/z388/PostNetOceanside/20160417_101913_zpsiais6kcw.jpg (http://s1187.photobucket.com/user/PostNetOceanside/media/20160417_101913_zpsiais6kcw.jpg.html)

Thanks for any input.

[chris138]

I have a Lowrance Elite 7 Chirp, an suggestions on settings? Can't seem to get it tuned in.

That's a tough question without a bunch of other info... but I'm going to assume you mean for targeting yt in LJ or similar area. Also assuming your transducer is mounted in the water.

Splitscreen mid/hi chirp, ping on fastest setting, auto bottom lock on, sensitivity auto +1 or 2, colorline about 60%, scroll speed 2x, clarity and noise filters +1.

Start there, take a picture, post it here. Cheers!

[45user]

This thread is awesome! I always wasn't sure what I was looking at..I kind of figured out baitball but still not 100%
I have HDS gen2 with 50/200 transducer and I can't really get tuned in..
Any suggestions?
Thank you!
45


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[acorad]

Great thread! I bought a FF last year, but have never used it.

This is giving me the motivation!

Need to get an over-the-side arm for the transducer...

Andy

[NICKWORN]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170914/4449e91ca3f763c61b337b529259364f.jpg

DORADO. YOU'RE BITTTTTTT


https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170914/7dbcd06ca14c8e3453f9dd0f8efe715b.jpg

Open for interpretation....


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



That looks like Jims boat!! :the_finger:

[chris138]

Thanks for the thread. I have a few images I would like to share and get your opinion on what you see. I didn't catch any fish during these meter reads.


Thanks for any input.

Thanks for checking in. First off, were these taken in La Jolla near the corner or somewhere with similar structure? The reason I ask is some of it looks like kelp to me. But if you were in a sandy area with no kelp around I might reconsider.

#1: settings look really good in this one. To me this looks like a big school of fish... not huge fish but not tiny bait either. I've seen big schools of sandbass and calicos mark like this. Also, over rocky reef areas, you will see ocean whitefish and blacksmith perch look like this. Blacksmith or whitefish would explain why you never got a bite. I've seen big schools of yt look kinda like this, but they would be harder marks with a lot more bright reds and yellows in there.

#2: Sensitivity is way too high for that depth, need to dial it back a lot. Tough to tell what is there with all washed out like that, but I think I see your dropperloop or some bait down. And probably some baits and small fish checking it out.

#3 setting looks great. here we have a big vertical strand of kelp in the middle, and a couple of good wads of mackerel feeding at about 20-25'. Also some scattered debris and probably rockfish on the bottom. here you should be working that sibiki shallow, they look like good greenbacks or big spanish.

#4: shallow water again. Your sensitivity is a little hot, but much better than #2. The big worm in the middle is marking too soft to be a fish. With your gain up that high (bottom is super hot and top ten feet are washed out), a big fish or mammal would come back bright yellow in that shallow. However, in the bottom left of the shot, there looks like there was a good little wad of fish on the bottom. Could be some corvina, mackerel or small bass or something along those lines.

[makobob]

Looks like Jim's boat and it has been Baja tested and PASSED. Tight line amigos.

[steveooo]

What are these? Are they tasty? :D:D

http://www.bigwatersedge.com/bwegallery/data/500/shot002.jpg















































*edit* chewy jacks

http://www.bigwatersedge.com/bwegallery/data/500/IMG_44341.JPG

[ful-rac]

They look like PANCAKES stacked up like PANCAKES! :eek:

[Denis_Ruso]

:Dexplain to me why I still cant get a bite :D

[goldenglory18]

My Dragonfly 7 pro is getting a soft install Friday and I'm so stoked. I'll be taking it out for a quick paddle on Sat for a final adjustment before final hard install with in-hull wiring and plastics painting.

I can't wait!!! :reel:

[chris138]

:Dexplain to me why I still cant get a bite :D

I think you need to wiggle your bait more dude :cheers1:

[Orca Winfrey]

Great thread! I bought a FF last year, but have never used it.

This is giving me the motivation!

Need to get an over-the-side arm for the transducer...

Andy

Or just go with a friend who has one and knows how to read it.

[acorad]

Or just go with a friend who has one and knows how to read it.

Yep.

Andy

[Dirty Curti]

Thanks for checking in. First off, were these taken in La Jolla near the corner or somewhere with similar structure? The reason I ask is some of it looks like kelp to me. But if you were in a sandy area with no kelp around I might reconsider.

#1: settings look really good in this one. To me this looks like a big school of fish... not huge fish but not tiny bait either. I've seen big schools of sandbass and calicos mark like this. Also, over rocky reef areas, you will see ocean whitefish and blacksmith perch look like this. Blacksmith or whitefish would explain why you never got a bite. I've seen big schools of yt look kinda like this, but they would be harder marks with a lot more bright reds and yellows in there.

#2: Sensitivity is way too high for that depth, need to dial it back a lot. Tough to tell what is there with all washed out like that, but I think I see your dropperloop or some bait down. And probably some baits and small fish checking it out.

#3 setting looks great. here we have a big vertical strand of kelp in the middle, and a couple of good wads of mackerel feeding at about 20-25'. Also some scattered debris and probably rockfish on the bottom. here you should be working that sibiki shallow, they look like good greenbacks or big spanish.

#4: shallow water again. Your sensitivity is a little hot, but much better than #2. The big worm in the middle is marking too soft to be a fish. With your gain up that high (bottom is super hot and top ten feet are washed out), a big fish or mammal would come back bright yellow in that shallow. However, in the bottom left of the shot, there looks like there was a good little wad of fish on the bottom. Could be some corvina, mackerel or small bass or something along those lines.


Great info thanks.

This is near the pipe in carlsbad.

Your comment regarding the "big worm" in photo 4 is to soft to be a fish. That confuses me because this is what I would expect to see if there is a larger fish under the kayak. So you said that if it was a bigger fish in water that shallow that I would see bright yellow color in the mark?

Also, Is there a way to understand a mark being on the left or right side of the kayak? Or where you should be casting when marks show up?

[chris138]

Great info thanks.

This is near the pipe in carlsbad.

Your comment regarding the "big worm" in photo 4 is to soft to be a fish. That confuses me because this is what I would expect to see if there is a larger fish under the kayak. So you said that if it was a bigger fish in water that shallow that I would see bright yellow color in the mark?

Also, Is there a way to understand a mark being on the left or right side of the kayak? Or where you should be casting when marks show up?

Yes. The purplish return that you see there is probably some kind of kelp or debris floating midcolumn. If you were in 140' of water and saw that mark, I would say it might be a fish. But for how shallow you are in that pic, and how high your gain is set, a hard-bodied object would come back yellow, if not bright red/orange. Some may disagree with me... it's only my opinion.

You really can't tell which side of you the fish is on for the most part. I should note that its not impossible to tell, but its a very advanced technique without sidescan. The technique must be done with dual frequency, and requires a sideways oriented drift. The two sonar cones are not identical, and you can infer information from the overlap of the two signals. So if you drifted directly over an object (assume it's stationary) it would show up on 83 kHz first, then it would show up identically hard on both frequencies, then disappear from 200 and only be on 83 again. At this point you would know the object was on the upwind side as you drifted directly over it. If you practice this technique often, you can start to predict when the object will take this path. So once you just barely start to get the return on 200kHz, you can infer that it is down-drift from you.

Anyone follow that?

You can also slowly zigzag across an area and make similar inferences. Like I said, it's an advanced technique and takes 100's of "sonar hours" to be effective.

I had an idea for an invention which would have a dual spectrum return that could differentiate between port and starboard orientation. Anyone know an acoustic engineer?

[GregAndrew]

Hey Gang,

I feel like a lot of people have the same kinds of questions when it comes to sonar... Especially from those folks who have just recently got their first fish finder, or have upgraded or switched brands. In internet forums, you typically want to avoid having a bunch of different threads about the same topic. It makes it hard for people to go back and search for the info they need.

Some of you who have followed me for a while know that I like to offer sonar tips to fellow kayakers when I can. So I thought I would start my own sonar thread, and try to make it more of a centralized location for some of this info.

The format I envision is that people can ask some of their sonar questions here. I'll do my best to check in often, and answer the best I can. Other more experienced members should chime in and address whatever they want, or tear my theories to shreds if you want... I can take it don't worry (;

What the thread is NOT for: Put-downs or trolling others, arguing with others about which brand or product is better than another, online deals or people trying to sell their stuff. I use Lowrance, but I will not try to sell their stuff or try to convince you that it is better than another product. This should be the place for technical discussion and sonar theory.

I'll kick it off with a few sonar tips for beginners, and a few screen shots from my IG archives :yt::wsb:


1. Try to mount the transducer in the water. Yes, shooting through the hull works, especially if installed by experts like the guys at OEX. I've done it both ways with the same FF and trust me you are losing sensitivity and signal strength. I would go with a RAM boom arm over a through-hull install every time.

2. Use separate power supply for FF and bait tank. This is for obvious reasons, if one system goes down you don't lose the other device. An entry level sonar like an Elite 4x for example uses very little amperage without GPS. The pump will drain batteries fast, especially 12V. Learn how much juice you need for your setup, and size your batteries appropriately.

3. Stuff will corrode, and need to be repaired. Next time you're at OEX or west marine, buy a bunch of extra terminal connectors, heat shrink butt connectors, and wire. Have all that stuff with you at the launch so when your sonar doesn't turn on, you can repair it right then. Make your wiring easily accessible and give yourself extra slack in case you have to cut and reconnect.

Now the "plotter porn" :eek:

Kamakazi Yellowtail!

https://i.imgur.com/ut6ehsYl.jpg

Fatty Homeguard Dives on my Dropper.

https://i.imgur.com/sXOEWUNl.jpg

Slug Halibut Stacked Like Pancakes!

https://i.imgur.com/PfPbyM1l.png

Looks like WSB to me... what do you think?

https://i.imgur.com/pAdlIGJl.png

School of YT breezing through mid column, out on the periphery of the cone.

https://i.imgur.com/5XN8Wu7l.png

I would have a few different interpretations on these.
Photo 1, I would agree with.
Photo 2, could be a YT, WSB or even a Sea Lion. I would go with what I caught or saw.
Photo 3, I would not guess Halibut unless you have your colorline very high. They are a demersal fish with no swim bladder and generally don't mark in hard colors (like many sharks and rays). I would guess YT or WSB.
Photo 4, By the thickness of the mark at that depth I would lean towards YT, but it could be a WSB.
Photo 5, By the depth and thickness of marks I would guess good sized Macks, Bonito or small YT.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170914/4449e91ca3f763c61b337b529259364f.jpg

DORADO. YOU'RE BITTTTTTT


https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170914/7dbcd06ca14c8e3453f9dd0f8efe715b.jpg

Open for interpretation....


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Photo 1, I can't pick out anything but bait in that pic.
Photo 2, The mark on the bottom appears to be a large fish, but I would bet it is a tightly grouped school of smaller fish. The broken edges of the mark over the entire length indicate that.

Thanks for the thread. I have a few images I would like to share and get your opinion on what you see. I didn't catch any fish during these meter reads.

http://i1187.photobucket.com/albums/z388/PostNetOceanside/20160417_114523_zpsqhmejaoc.jpg (http://s1187.photobucket.com/user/PostNetOceanside/media/20160417_114523_zpsqhmejaoc.jpg.html)



http://i1187.photobucket.com/albums/z388/PostNetOceanside/20160417_104524_zpsuwyldbhd.jpg (http://s1187.photobucket.com/user/PostNetOceanside/media/20160417_104524_zpsuwyldbhd.jpg.html)



http://i1187.photobucket.com/albums/z388/PostNetOceanside/20160417_124203_zpsxyaebfh1.jpg (http://s1187.photobucket.com/user/PostNetOceanside/media/20160417_124203_zpsxyaebfh1.jpg.html)



http://i1187.photobucket.com/albums/z388/PostNetOceanside/20160417_101913_zpsiais6kcw.jpg (http://s1187.photobucket.com/user/PostNetOceanside/media/20160417_101913_zpsiais6kcw.jpg.html)

Thanks for any input.
Photo 1, Looks like a bait ball of either Spanish or Blacksmith (judging by individual mark size and coloring).
Photo 2, You are on the wrong frequency and over gained in that depth of water.
Photo 3, Mixed species school of bait, or could be some smaller predators among them.
Photo 4, That mark looks like a fish to me. I would guess that it is either a fish with no swim bladder or it is staying just outside of your transducer cone angle, or both.

What are these? Are they tasty? :D:D

http://www.bigwatersedge.com/bwegallery/data/500/shot002.jpg















































*edit* chewy jacks

http://www.bigwatersedge.com/bwegallery/data/500/IMG_44341.JPG
Perfect example of cone angle. The arches that are Red and solid are moving directly through the cone angle. The ones that remain blue and broken are outside the cone angle. The thickness of the bars, in the cone, are just the right size for the depth of water to match YT.


:Dexplain to me why I still cant get a bite :D
I can show you hours of video footage on fish not biting. Almost all of it can be attributed to a sluggish or oddly moving bait.

[chris138]

I would have a few different interpretations on these.
Photo 1, I would agree with.
Photo 2, could be a YT, WSB or even a Sea Lion. I would go with what I caught or saw.
Photo 3, I would not guess Halibut unless you have your colorline very high. They are a demersal fish with no swim bladder and generally don't mark in hard colors (like many sharks and rays). I would guess YT or WSB.
Photo 4, By the thickness of the mark at that depth I would lean towards YT, but it could be a WSB.
Photo 5, By the depth and thickness of marks I would guess good sized Macks, Bonito or small YT.


I can show you hours of video footage on fish not biting. Almost all of it can be attributed to a sluggish or oddly moving bait.

Hey Greg, thanks for chiming in! You have a very unique perspective of sonar returns, given your awesome video vantage. Most of the time when I claim a species, it's because I was bit on those marks. But not always...

I agree on #3, i happened to get a halibut at the time, however there were lots of YT around as well so you could be correct.

#2, Looks very much like a dog. But I got crushed by a 30# yt on that mark. I actually got the gopro footage of the mark, as it was diving then the bite on video. Edit will be coming... :cheers1:

#4, could be yellow but a little "wormy" for me. This was on a day when all three slam species were around.

#5 agree... could be boney. But a nearby friend caught yt right after so that was the basis of my assumption. And you are correct about them being smaller grade... 15-20#s.

Greg makes a great point here. The only time you know for sure what the mark was, is when you catch off the mark. The first time you do this, and watch the fish hit your bait, you will gain a profound sense of accomplishment and confidence!

[chris138]

What are these? Are they tasty? :D:D

http://www.bigwatersedge.com/bwegallery/data/500/shot002.jpg

*edit* chewy jacks

http://www.bigwatersedge.com/bwegallery/data/500/IMG_44341.JPG

PREFACE: no disrespect intended SteveOOO. Thanks for posting! Purely my opinion and I could be completely full of it...

To me, these marks don't look like fish. Not sure that I know exactly where this is, but looks to me to be an outside rocky kelp ledge area. Bull kelp zone.

Note the symmetry and length of the marks. See how they are vertically stacked and all similar length, thickness, and heat. I see how both the "head" and the "tail" of the marks are all very similar, and taper off to a pointy tip, without much change in depth. To me this is indicative of stationary objects, or something that is drifting passively in the current. Yellowtail seldom sit still, and are usually very erratic looking and asymmetrical. The marks will look all "tangled" as the fish change depth and react to each other.

This looks like a deep kelp ledge with a good amount of current, and bait in the bull kelp pinned down to the bottom. No doubt prime YT feeding grounds and epic conditions. Cheers boys! :cheers1: :yt::yt::yt:

[steveooo]

...Not sure that I know exactly where this is...

That was LJ, out in the sandy squid grounds. We caught yoyo YT off it.

One sonar setting that is worth putting into the discussion is Sonar Scroll Speed. It doesn’t change what you see on the meter, but it does change how it appears on the meter. I find setting a faster scroll speed will give me more of a real time picture of what is under the boat. It also gives more defined, and longer individual fish arches. Our kayaks move relatively slow, and sometimes we are chasing fish that move relatively fast (YT). I think of the slower scroll speed as the history channel, or “old news”, where sometimes what is shown on the meter is long gone, but it just hasn’t left the screen yet.

The best time to experiment with this setting is when making bait. With the new chirp units, adjusting scroll speed to a higher setting can make a bait ball go from looking like a cloud, to showing hundreds of individual tiny arches. IMO thats too much clutter for just making bait, but turning up the scroll speed also does the same for a school of YT, turning that mess of squiggly spaghetti hanging out under the kayak into more defined individual fish.

Fast scroll speed is my preference when yoyo fishing. When its there, its there. When dropper loop fishing or fishing for structure oriented fish, I’ll turn scroll speed back to normal, so I don’t blink and miss anything or leave an area prematurely. Normal or slower scroll speed is also good for giving a little more history of what the fish is doing under the kayak, e.g. showing a YT dive bombing your bait. Its really a matter of preference of how you want the fish & screen to look.

*disclaimer* I’ve caught many more fish through dumb luck than I have by using my sonar.

Good thread :cheers1:

[Sheephead]

Great thread idea Chris! I love how your naming your sonar marks too!



For the first two pictures I'd like to welcome everyone to the promised land.

The third picture is a good example of how bait reacts to a school of yellowtail. Even if your not marking yt if you see bait behavingg this way you can tell if fosh are around.

Lastly, the 4th pic shows a single yt swimming through a small school of red crab. Yes my settings suck! For yhe 4th pic.

[TJones]

Yes for sure you can. Sometimes the key with that is the color line. Play around with colorline until you get the kelp to mark really soft, then the fish or bait will stand out more. I also like downscan 455 kHz for this application, because you can see the individual kelp strands and a fish really sticks out.

If you can get the DS dialed in, then you can overlay it on top of your mid/high chirp... for a more advanced configuration.

:sifone:.

[summers in kuwait]

Thanks for the details Chris!:cheers1:
This is going to be a great thread for info... and fish finder porn!

[jbl_91762]

Great thread idea Chris! I love how your naming your sonar marks too!



For the first two pictures I'd like to welcome everyone to the promised land.

The third picture is a good example of how bait reacts to a school of yellowtail. Even if your not marking yt if you see bait behavingg this way you can tell if fosh are around.

Lastly, the 4th pic shows a single yt swimming through a small school of red crab. Yes my settings suck! For yhe 4th pic.


Thank you so much Chris for posting this and not sure why its not yet a sticky!! I've learned more from this post then any youtube vids I watch to learn as I am new to this. I didn't have the funds for a better FF but only have a Garmin Striker 4 and have no clue how to decipher except for bait and seaweed around Corona Del Mar.

Now 1st 2 pics those images are full of fish I presume? 3rd I would think was the sonar picking up your line dropped?? Please explain further.
Also anybody have a link to a really good youtube that explains more as I learn better with vids but have seriously learned from seeing these images also. Please keep it coming.

[jorluivil]

This should be a sticky..............in the funny section.

[oredith]

much more basic question for the sonar pros here:

how much difference does color make, on a scale of
"if it's not in color, you might as well just hold an etch-a-sketch"
to
"with enough knowledge, a monochrome is as good as colored"

I ask because i couldn't really make heads or tails of what my old (came with the yak) hook-4x was telling me. there were no friendly eyebrow shapes. I was primarily using the FF as a depth finder, and just to see what was under me (soft vs. hard surface).

is color FF a "game changer", where I should really just ditch the old monochrome hook-4 and get a new(er) one? or should I try to learn with the old hook-4 before getting a newer FF?

[ful-rac]

much more basic question for the sonar pros here:

how much difference does color make, on a scale of
"if it's not in color, you might as well just hold an etch-a-sketch"


If you mean on a scale of 1 to 10...10.




"with enough knowledge, a monochrome is as good as colored"



No.



is color FF a "game changer", where I should really just ditch the old monochrome hook-4 and get a new(er) one?

Yes, Yes.

should I try to learn with the old hook-4 before getting a newer FF?

No.

[jimmyjones]

What is a good starting point for settings for hook Five for local Waters 60 to150 ft thank you very much

[Sheephead]

much more basic question for the sonar pros here:

how much difference does color make, on a scale of
"if it's not in color, you might as well just hold an etch-a-sketch"
to
"with enough knowledge, a monochrome is as good as colored"

I ask because i couldn't really make heads or tails of what my old (came with the yak) hook-4x was telling me. there were no friendly eyebrow shapes. I was primarily using the FF as a depth finder, and just to see what was under me (soft vs. hard surface).

is color FF a "game changer", where I should really just ditch the old monochrome hook-4 and get a new(er) one? or should I try to learn with the old hook-4 before getting a newer FF?

I'd agree with color being very important. Before I went out with "The Darkhorse" I had my color down very low and although I wasn't exactly sure what to look for at the time low color definitely didn't help. Now I run 90-88% colorline (depending on the day) and it's amazing how much easier it is to identify fish.

[chris138]

If you mean on a scale of 1 to 10...10.




No.



Yes, Yes.



No.

Agree on all counts!

[chris138]

That was LJ, out in the sandy squid grounds. We caught yoyo YT off it.

One sonar setting that is worth putting into the discussion is Sonar Scroll Speed. It doesn’t change what you see on the meter, but it does change how it appears on the meter. I find setting a faster scroll speed will give me more of a real time picture of what is under the boat. It also gives more defined, and longer individual fish arches. Our kayaks move relatively slow, and sometimes we are chasing fish that move relatively fast (YT). I think of the slower scroll speed as the history channel, or “old news”, where sometimes what is shown on the meter is long gone, but it just hasn’t left the screen yet.

The best time to experiment with this setting is when making bait. With the new chirp units, adjusting scroll speed to a higher setting can make a bait ball go from looking like a cloud, to showing hundreds of individual tiny arches. IMO thats too much clutter for just making bait, but turning up the scroll speed also does the same for a school of YT, turning that mess of squiggly spaghetti hanging out under the kayak into more defined individual fish.

Fast scroll speed is my preference when yoyo fishing. When its there, its there. When dropper loop fishing or fishing for structure oriented fish, I’ll turn scroll speed back to normal, so I don’t blink and miss anything or leave an area prematurely. Normal or slower scroll speed is also good for giving a little more history of what the fish is doing under the kayak, e.g. showing a YT dive bombing your bait. Its really a matter of preference of how you want the fish & screen to look.

*disclaimer* I’ve caught many more fish through dumb luck than I have by using my sonar.

Good thread :cheers1:

Thanks for the info, and for joining in the conversation! As I said, I can be completely full of it! :)

[chris138]

What is a good starting point for settings for hook Five for local Waters 60 to150 ft thank you very much

Hello jimmyjones,

Please refer to post #19. Start there and post your questions or screen shots after you have tried those settings.

[Sheephead]

Thank you so much Chris for posting this and not sure why its not yet a sticky!! I've learned more from this post then any youtube vids I watch to learn as I am new to this. I didn't have the funds for a better FF but only have a Garmin Striker 4 and have no clue how to decipher except for bait and seaweed around Corona Del Mar.

Now 1st 2 pics those images are full of fish I presume? 3rd I would think was the sonar picking up your line dropped?? Please explain further.
Also anybody have a link to a really good youtube that explains more as I learn better with vids but have seriously learned from seeing these images also. Please keep it coming.

Pics 1 and 2 are the promised lands. Fish you drop on and instantly get bit by.
Pic 3 was a really cool experience. Yes, you can see my bait being dropped down towards the school of feeding YT but the pattern was so specific this day that it was hard to get bit. The yellow/orange dense dots on the bottom is bait, in this case red crab. On the left side of the picture you can see the school expanding into mid water column and rising up off the bottom as soon as the YT were out of range. The crab were being pushed off the bottom by a school of rockfish, halibut, bass, you name it. As soon as the YT came through again the crab school would get pushed back to the bottom (you can clearly see the school of YT swimming above the school of crab densely packed on the bottom). Towards the right end of the picture you can see the school of YT swimming directly into the suspended school of crab that wasn't quick enough to get back towards the bottom.

Im guessing the reason the YT were able to separate the school is because the crabs don't have lateral lines and because they were the furthest away from where the Yt entered the school they had less time to react to their presence.

[chris138]

Thank you so much Chris for posting this and not sure why its not yet a sticky!! I've learned more from this post then any youtube vids I watch to learn as I am new to this. I didn't have the funds for a better FF but only have a Garmin Striker 4 and have no clue how to decipher except for bait and seaweed around Corona Del Mar.

Now 1st 2 pics those images are full of fish I presume? 3rd I would think was the sonar picking up your line dropped?? Please explain further.
Also anybody have a link to a really good youtube that explains more as I learn better with vids but have seriously learned from seeing these images also. Please keep it coming.

Thanks JBL. Doesn't matter to me if it's sticky or not... as long as people want to keep discussing sonar theories and application, the thread will stick around.

Here's your rabbit hole, should you chose to take the blue pill...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Q9izOwp1aU&t=4749s

[Johnny Hirn]

I am looking at putting my lowrance elite 4x chirp transducer on the lowrance scupper plug mount for better clarity, however, as of now it is currently installed with the goop method. What is the best way of removing the transducer safely.
Tight lines,
Johnny.

[surfishiron]

hey Chris or Greg, whats your interpretation? Mine was YT balling up bait in the left corner and maybe pushing it low on the right of the screen. Any help is appreciated. FYI this is the best post ever!!!! Sticky for sure!!!22380

[ful-rac]

hey Chris or Greg, whats your interpretation? Mine was YT balling up bait in the left corner and maybe pushing it low on the right of the screen. Any help is appreciated. FYI this is the best post ever!!!! Sticky for sure!!!22380



Taking in account your depth, I would say most likely it's not yellowtail. It's quite possible it might be depending upon the location you are fishing. You have your FF setting on Medium Chirp and are in shallow water so everything is going to be a bit stretched out, making objects appear to be larger than they would be on High Chirp. Also a wider cone angle covering more area thus displaying more information or more objects in the same amount of space. To me if I saw that on my FF at this current time in the area I fish, I would interpret that more than likely as Bonita, mixed with those little yellows that have been around lately, chasing around bait.

Providing key information might help...

Where were you fishing?
What kind of structure is nearby?
When was the screen shot taken?
Did you catch anything?

You never really can know with absolute certainty of what your seeing on your fish finder unless you are actually catching what you are seeing. And even then the other fish or objects you are seeing on screen can be something completely different from what you are catching. With local knowledge of an area, where certain species are known to congregate, this information can help to narrow down what your seeing on screen can likely be or likely not be.

[chris138]

I am looking at putting my lowrance elite 4x chirp transducer on the lowrance scupper plug mount for better clarity, however, as of now it is currently installed with the goop method. What is the best way of removing the transducer safely.
Tight lines,
Johnny.

Johnny,

Shouldn't be too tough... if you used the actual brand "goop" you might have a chance to get it off clean. The key is gonna be not to put big scratches and abrasions on the "business end" of the transducer. That being said, you will probably have to cut it out if you cant just pull it off. When I removed mine back in the day, i got lucky and it all kinda peeled off as one piece. Maybe use some rubbing alcohol or some thing to clean the adhesive off, but i wouldn't get too crazy with the industrial solvents as you might degrade the plastic on the 'ducer, or on your hull. You want to get that thing as clean as possible.

Worst case scenario buy a transducer on ebay. everything else will work fine with the new transducer as long as you get the right one.

[chris138]

hey Chris or Greg, whats your interpretation? Mine was YT balling up bait in the left corner and maybe pushing it low on the right of the screen. Any help is appreciated. FYI this is the best post ever!!!! Sticky for sure!!!22380

for sure that's some bait balled up on the left... but not necessarily being predated on. Could just be really tight feeding on zooplankton. Definitely some faster, harder bodied fish cruising through there, but I would tend to agree with Tony that they don't look yellow for how shallow you are. could be you are catching the edge of a couple bigger fish swimming in the periphery of the cone. Settings look good though, other than being sideways;) your return has good target separation.

[Johnny Hirn]

Johnny,

Shouldn't be too tough... if you used the actual brand "goop" you might have a chance to get it off clean. The key is gonna be not to put big scratches and abrasions on the "business end" of the transducer. That being said, you will probably have to cut it out if you cant just pull it off. When I removed mine back in the day, i got lucky and it all kinda peeled off as one piece. Maybe use some rubbing alcohol or some thing to clean the adhesive off, but i wouldn't get too crazy with the industrial solvents as you might degrade the plastic on the 'ducer, or on your hull. You want to get that thing as clean as possible.

Worst case scenario buy a transducer on ebay. everything else will work fine with the new transducer as long as you get the right one.

Thanks for the help!

[ful-rac]

What could this be...?

http://www.bigwatersedge.com/bwegallery/data/500/20170917_160824000_iOS.png

[GregAndrew]

hey Chris or Greg, whats your interpretation? Mine was YT balling up bait in the left corner and maybe pushing it low on the right of the screen. Any help is appreciated. FYI this is the best post ever!!!! Sticky for sure!!!22380

I would also agree that they do not look like large predators. The two schools of bait are different species on left and right. Left side I would bet are either Sardines or Herring. Right side I would bet on Spanish, but there are several other species that might fit that bill. Certainly not Greenies (color would be similar to the Left side and bigger marks), although the predators could be the larger versions of those.

[Denis_Ruso]

hey Chris or Greg, whats your interpretation? Mine was YT balling up bait in the left corner and maybe pushing it low on the right of the screen. Any help is appreciated. FYI this is the best post ever!!!! Sticky for sure!!!22380

I'll take a crack at it. Looking like a baitball on the beginning then looks to be a more like school of blue perch that hang out in the kelp at LJ. Not looking like YT marks to me, arches are too small and movement is too scattered.

[Denis_Ruso]

I am looking at putting my lowrance elite 4x chirp transducer on the lowrance scupper plug mount for better clarity, however, as of now it is currently installed with the goop method. What is the best way of removing the transducer safely.
Tight lines,
Johnny.

Someone else could chime in but when I used plummers putty for my previous install, it helped to warm it up with a blowdryer/heat gun to peel off. You may have luck with the same method removing goop.

[Fishing619]

I'm looking for a new FF around $500 to $600 for a PA14
what do you recommend? I have look and they are a lot of
Options it get overwhelm thanks.

[ful-rac]

Lowrance HDS 7, Gen2-Gen3

[surfishiron]

Taking in account your depth, I would say most likely it's not yellowtail. It's quite possible it might be depending upon the location you are fishing. You have your FF setting on Medium Chirp and are in shallow water so everything is going to be a bit stretched out, making objects appear to be larger than they would be on High Chirp. Also a wider cone angle covering more area thus displaying more information or more objects in the same amount of space. To me if I saw that on my FF at this current time in the area I fish, I would interpret that more than likely as Bonita, mixed with those little yellows that have been around lately, chasing around bait.

Providing key information might help...

Where were you fishing?
What kind of structure is nearby?
When was the screen shot taken?
Did you catch anything?

You never really can know with absolute certainty of what your seeing on your fish finder unless you are actually catching what you are seeing. And even then the other fish or objects you are seeing on screen can be something completely different from what you are catching. With local knowledge of an area, where certain species are known to congregate, this information can help to narrow down what your seeing on screen can likely be or likely not be.

First of all thank you to all that replied this is valuable info that i appreciate from the community. To answer Tony's questions I was fishing my super secret spot you probly don't know it is call La Jolla. Named by the Germans in 1903, there was structure nearby roughly 100-200 yards, screenshot was very recent, I caught several bonies and one YT. I never thought about depth when is came to sonar readings and or my settings in shallow vs deeper water. Appreciate the input from those more experienced than myself. Also never thought of using a different chirp setting based on my depth due to the fact that I usually fisht 70+ to 200. Once again thank you and I cant wait to bring more screen shots to this threat.

[jorluivil]

This is all I see on my screen.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
Any guess what it could be?

http://www.retroland.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/Missile-Command.jpg

[MITCHELL]

:doh::doh:

[MITCHELL]

On my fish finder.....

[INGRIDSDAD]

I recently upgraded to the HDS7 gen 3, has anyone messed with the total scan transducer? Any advantage over the 50/200?

[chris138]

I recently upgraded to the HDS7 gen 3, has anyone messed with the total scan transducer? Any advantage over the 50/200?

I personally have not... but I've read up on it and apparently it's bitchin. Its one for the first consumer grade sidescan transducers on the market... and definitely one of the best for rec fishers. The thing can allow you to generate 3D bathymetric maps of the sea floor!

Aside from all of the awesomeness of the total scan, it comes with one huge drawback for kayak. In order for the side scan to work, the transducer must sit proud of the bottom of your boat. It has to be able to see out to the sides, so it cant be recessed into the transducer scupper. That's fine on the water, but when you go to launch or land on sand (or worse yet rocks or a boat launch) the transducer will scrape on the ground. Scratching up the surface of the ducer is bad and will mess with its precision.

If I were gonna try the total scan, I would go with a boom arm over the scupper mount. Then you could just pull it out the of the water for launch and landing. :cheers1:

[chris138]

This is all I see on my screen.

.
.
Any guess what it could be?

http://www.retroland.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/Missile-Command.jpg

WOPR... shall we play a game? How about tick tack toe? :D

[MITCHELL]

Tangles with your sabiki rig.....

[chris138]

Bump to 2020! Here's some shots from the end of 2019, hope your sounders are dialed in the new decade!

https://i.imgur.com/TJ1k6vO.jpg?1

https://i.imgur.com/izh3n9G.jpg?1

https://i.imgur.com/Zqbd92u.jpg?1

https://i.imgur.com/qoQRVQs.jpg?1

https://i.imgur.com/DYcEMFE.jpg?1

https://i.imgur.com/5BSgno7.jpg?1

[acorad]

Bump to 2020! Here's some shots from the end of 2019, hope your sounders are dialed in the new decade!


I think yours is broken, it makes everything look like slug YTs.

[Newguyhere]

Does anyone have setting suggestions for hook 2 5 splitshot if I'm 100+ feet. Could not seem to figure it out. At all.

[Newguyhere]

Pics

[TJones]

Pics

:confused:. that does not look good at all. you got some sore of interference. bad wire, bad ground, maybe bad transducer? try running demo and see what happens if that unit has this option? check your transducer plug and make sure it is seated well. no matter what you did with settings, your screen should not have that fuzzy bar. in another thread you had mentioned that you were loosing picture after a certain depth. check your depth settings and leave it on auto. you it is set at manual of 100' and you go out of range, the unit will go haywire.

[Newguyhere]

It's just weird bc it seems to work fine under 100 feet.

[chris138]

Did you ever get this figured out?

[Newguyhere]

I did not. From what I've read though the cheaper lowrance units are hit or miss. I only paid 80 bucks for it after rebates and sale.
I ended up upgrading to a Garmin echomap plus 64cv.

[chris138]

I did not. From what I've read though the cheaper lowrance units are hit or miss. I only paid 80 bucks for it after rebates and sale.
I ended up upgrading to a Garmin echomap plus 64cv.

Right on. I've heard similar things. The kayak life is probably the harshest environment for a sonar. Often its corrosion on the connector pins or power supply terminals that causes problems, but also the power supply fuse can give you issues too. Ever since I had like three of those damn fuses corrode I wont even install it anymore.

You will have to let us know how you like your Garmin, I have heard good things.

[YakDout]

It's just weird bc it seems to work fine under 100 feet.


If there are other boats and or kayaks in the area, that interference can be caused by they’re transducer. Especially if their gain is high. The waves between your boats are essentially crossing each other.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Salty]

What destroyed my mac?? Mac was on a 6oz drop shot. No sea lions in the area. Got this mark and about a minute later this happened to my mac. Could feel several strong hits, kept the drag a little loose, hoping it would take the hook. Something ran with it pretty good, then nothing. Twisted the hook up pretty good/

[SoCalEDC]

What destroyed my mac?? Mac was on a 6oz drop shot. No sea lions in the area. Got this mark and about a minute later this happened to my mac. Could feel several strong hits, kept the drag a little loose, hoping it would take the hook. Something ran with it pretty good, then nothing. Twisted the hook up pretty good/

You sure it wasn't a sea lion? I have had them do that exact same thing to my baits on multiple occasions. They are smart enough to avoid that hook (usually)

[Salty]

You sure it wasn't a sea lion? I have had them do that exact same thing to my baits on multiple occasions. They are smart enough to avoid that hook (usually)

Yeah, I've had them do the exact same thing many times too(and same thing with roosters in southern Baja!). Sea lions were not around me at the time. Usually I'll see them in the area approaching or mark them diving/surfacing on the finder. Whatever it was was hitting it in about 5 second intervals before finally running with it. and taking everything but the head. Weight was on the bottom, Mac was about 10" up the line on a short dropper loop

[GregAndrew]

Well, this thread has not seen much action for a while. Though I might add a few pics for discussion. What do you think you see here?

[socal.beach.bum]

Well, this thread has not seen much action for a while. Though I might add a few pics for discussion. What do you think you see here?

Looks like berries chasing a bait ball.

[deptrai]

Last weekend.
Raymarine Dragonfly7Pro. Transducer mounted in Hobie Outback external pocket with BerleyPro cover.

School of Black Rockfish outside of Depoe Bay.

[socal.beach.bum]

Last weekend.
Raymarine Dragonfly7Pro. Transducer mounted in Hobie Outback external pocket with BerleyPro cover.

School of Black Rockfish outside of Depoe Bay.

So jealous you guys get to pull up dungies up there.

[chris138]

Well, this thread has not seen much action for a while. Though I might add a few pics for discussion. What do you think you see here?

My guess is this is a giant squadron of bat rays feeding on smelt. :eek:

Haha rad marks Greg, why do I get the feeling your downrigger cam is in there somewhere. :luxhello:

[FullFlavorPike]

Maybe that first photo is a large torpedo weight, with a fish coming off the bottom, eating the attached bait, and then pulling a GTFO downwards and out of the sonar cone.

[Polychrest]

Great info in here. Couple of noob questions.
1. What depth should I switch from High to Mid CHIRP?
2. Any reason to not use CHIRP?

[GregAndrew]

Great info in here. Couple of noob questions.
1. What depth should I switch from High to Mid CHIRP?
2. Any reason to not use CHIRP?

You are better off thinking of that first question in reverse. You want to use medium where you can and switch to High when you are getting too much clutter on your screen. But the answer is going to be based on your settings. The lower you have your sensitivity set at, the shallower you can use it.

After using Chirp, and getting my settings worked in, I dont see any reason I would go back to standard.

[GregAndrew]

My guess is this is a giant squadron of bat rays feeding on smelt. :eek:

Haha rad marks Greg, why do I get the feeling your downrigger cam is in there somewhere. :luxhello:

The second shot had my camera down there. Had to bring it up off the bottom and into the mix. You can see it 8 or 10 feet off the bottom on the left side.

[GregAndrew]

Maybe that first photo is a large torpedo weight, with a fish coming off the bottom, eating the attached bait, and then pulling a GTFO downwards and out of the sonar cone.

That is a very good start, but there is more to it than that.

[SoCalEDC]

Well, this thread has not seen much action for a while. Though I might add a few pics for discussion. What do you think you see here?

pic one looks like weight or jig and fish coming up off of the bottom to strike it, and then dropping it shortly after, perhaps it struck the weight rather than the bait. Maybe a halibut, who realizes hes been had.

The second looks like a school of bigger fish maybe calicos feeding on sardines or another small-medium sized bait fish around some kelp.

if i had to guess.

[GregAndrew]

pic one looks like weight or jig and fish coming up off of the bottom to strike it, and then dropping it shortly after, perhaps it struck the weight rather than the bait. Maybe a halibut, who realizes hes been had.

The second looks like a school of bigger fish maybe calicos feeding on sardines or another small-medium sized bait fish around some kelp.

if i had to guess.

Another couple of pretty good guesses. On the first one you pretty much got it up until "perhaps". Btw, Halibut have no air bladder and will not give you a very strong return (color) until they are pretty close to your transducer.

On the second, you were doing pretty good up until "calicos".

[TCS]

What Palette do folks use for fishing LJ?

[GregAndrew]

What Palette do folks use for fishing LJ?

You should be able to put your unit in simulation mode and play around with your pallette, sensitivity and colorline. Chose a pallette that your eye picks up strong returns with best.

[chris138]

What Palette do folks use for fishing LJ?

Personally I like the default white Lowrance best. I played around with blue background variations but they just don't pop as well in the glare for me.

[FISH11]

Personally I like the default white Lowrance best. I played around with blue background variations but they just don't pop as well in the glare for me.

X2

[JohnMckroidJr]

Though I might add a few pics for discussion. What do you think you see here?

First one:
The line at 50ft from left to center screen is a lead weight or jig of some sort. A predator fish comes up and checks it out. The weight gets pulled up to about 40 ft, then lowered back down towards the bottom as it approaches the cloud of bait on the right side of the screen.

Most of the productive fishing in my area is in 2-5 times that depth of water. When I use a downrigger, I see similar stuff.

Second one:
Is tougher because there is no reference of depth distances to help determine the size of the targets. On the far left, I see the weight or jig? (straight line...as it is dragged into the school). I will guess a large form of baitfish, possibly with some interference, or possibly feeding on a smaller form of baitfish.

In my area, That looks like Barjacks or Bluerunner, neither of which are on the West Coast.


Any UW video?

[GregAndrew]

First one:
The line at 50ft from left to center screen is a lead weight or jig of some sort. A predator fish comes up and checks it out. The weight gets pulled up to about 40 ft, then lowered back down towards the bottom as it approaches the cloud of bait on the right side of the screen.

Most of the productive fishing in my area is in 2-5 times that depth of water. When I use a downrigger, I see similar stuff.

Second one:
Is tougher because there is no reference of depth distances to help determine the size of the targets. On the far left, I see the weight or jig? (straight line...as it is dragged into the school). I will guess a large form of baitfish, possibly with some interference, or possibly feeding on a smaller form of baitfish.

In my area, That looks like Barjacks or Bluerunner, neither of which are on the West Coast.


Any UW video?

The first one is my 8oz torpedo on the left side. You can make out my 10" Greenie barely as the broken dotted line above the sinker. The fish bit and spit initially, then you can see that I began to bounce my bait by what the sinker is doing (bait had been on the hook for a while, and I did not know how lively it was). A bit before both big marks end, the fish bit again and this time it stuck. Both sinker and fish left my sonar cone quickly (although in opposite directions). That fish ended up being a 64# WSB.

The second one is my downrigger ball down below the school of fish on the left side. You can vaguely make out that I cranked it up in 2 steps a total of about 12 feet (in order to put my camera in the middle of the school). I also cranked up my bait after each of the steps, to bring it back in view. The vertical movements on the right side are when the fish bit and I set the hook. Although I did not maintain good pressure, and allowed the fish to shake the hook. But I did get the bite on video (but it is poor visibility). That was a school of WSB probably in the 25-40# range (at least the ones I could see).

[Oolie]

The first one is my 8oz torpedo on the left side. You can make out my 10" Greenie barely as the broken dotted line above the sinker. The fish bit and spit initially, then you can see that I began to bounce my bait by what the sinker is doing (bait had been on the hook for a while, and I did not know how lively it was). A bit before both big marks end, the fish bit again and this time it stuck. Both sinker and fish left my sonar cone quickly (although in opposite directions). That fish ended up being a 64# WSB.

The second one is my downrigger ball down below the school of fish on the left side. You can vaguely make out that I cranked it up in 2 steps a total of about 12 feet (in order to put my camera in the middle of the school). I also cranked up my bait after each of the steps, to bring it back in view. The vertical movements on the right side are when the fish bit and I set the hook. Although I did not maintain good pressure, and allowed the fish to shake the hook. But I did get the bite on video (but it is poor visibility). That was a school of WSB probably in the 25-40# range (at least the ones I could see).
Congrats!

[chris138]

The first one is my 8oz torpedo on the left side. You can make out my 10" Greenie barely as the broken dotted line above the sinker. The fish bit and spit initially, then you can see that I began to bounce my bait by what the sinker is doing (bait had been on the hook for a while, and I did not know how lively it was). A bit before both big marks end, the fish bit again and this time it stuck. Both sinker and fish left my sonar cone quickly (although in opposite directions). That fish ended up being a 64# WSB.

The second one is my downrigger ball down below the school of fish on the left side. You can vaguely make out that I cranked it up in 2 steps a total of about 12 feet (in order to put my camera in the middle of the school). I also cranked up my bait after each of the steps, to bring it back in view. The vertical movements on the right side are when the fish bit and I set the hook. Although I did not maintain good pressure, and allowed the fish to shake the hook. But I did get the bite on video (but it is poor visibility). That was a school of WSB probably in the 25-40# range (at least the ones I could see).

I call BS without the video. Looks like bat rays to me.

;):notworthy:

[GregAndrew]

I call BS without the video. Looks like bat rays to me.

;):notworthy:

Yep, you caught me Chris!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YW4XWP17hVE

[SoCalEDC]

Yep, you caught me Chris!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YW4XWP17hVE

Thats one of the coolest underwater "home" videos I've seen

[JohnMckroidJr]

The first one is my 8oz torpedo on the left side. You can make out my 10" Greenie barely as the broken dotted line above the sinker. The fish bit and spit initially, then you can see that I began to bounce my bait by what the sinker is doing (bait had been on the hook for a while, and I did not know how lively it was). A bit before both big marks end, the fish bit again and this time it stuck. Both sinker and fish left my sonar cone quickly (although in opposite directions). That fish ended up being a 64# WSB.

The second one is my downrigger ball down below the school of fish on the left side. You can vaguely make out that I cranked it up in 2 steps a total of about 12 feet (in order to put my camera in the middle of the school). I also cranked up my bait after each of the steps, to bring it back in view. The vertical movements on the right side are when the fish bit and I set the hook. Although I did not maintain good pressure, and allowed the fish to shake the hook. But I did get the bite on video (but it is poor visibility). That was a school of WSB probably in the 25-40# range (at least the ones I could see).

Congrats on the first one, nice fish story on the second one, cool video of the Bat Rays.