Children's Pool

[PB fisher]

I did not have time to make the meeting today? Anyone know how it went??

[dsafety]

I just heard the news report. It did not go our way. This is not yet a done deal but it appears that the City Council caved to the people who think cute seals are more important than our cute children.

I grew up in La Jolla and the CP was my favorite place to go as a young kid. I could swim, snorkel and climb the rocks searching for sea creatures. All within a very safe confined space under the watchful eyes of the Lifeguards. Everything that makes this place an ideal kayak launching spot makes it perfect for families with young children.

The fact that the seals and those who love them have stolen this treasure from our kids is a tragedy. Unfortunately only those of us who had the opportunity to enjoy this unique place in the past will truely understand what may be taken away from future generations.

It is highly unlikely that the CP will ever be made available as a kayak launching spot, (search some of my previous posts for details if you are interested). With that battle lost, I am hopeful that reason will prevail as the battle over the CP approaches its climax.

Bob

[Billy V]

Its not over yet. They will have to undo one of the most powerful legal documents a person could create, a Trust, and or a Last Will and Testament.

It doesn't matter what the city wants, the decree made in the Trust is clear, and the law is on the side of the Trust.

The City Council is not a Superior Court, nor are any of them Judges.
-----------------------------------------
As a side note
I would not want to go against the resources of the Scripps Family, and could only imagine how much money it will cost the City to defend against a law suit for "Breach of Trust" brought by the Scripps Family.

The CP could possibly revert back to the heirs if the Trust and its intentions were violated.

All the city did was hand off this mess to the Superior Court.

2 cents.

[dsafety]

Billy, that was worth easily 4 cents. I just hope you are right.

Bob

[PB fisher]

Good point on the trust being the last will and testament. I agree.

Does the city realize it is called the children's pool?

[prowlerdude]

Once again our elected officials refused to make any decision and dumped it on the State. Just like the booze ban (sending it to the voters). Anything remotely controversial that could cost them future votes down the road is taboo.

To vote against the seals - anti green
To vote for the seals - anti children, recreation and business (these nuts are for extending the MLPA to freaking china).

Politicians are only in it for themselves and their futures..

Sorry for the rant

[Podaker]

this is not a natural habitat for the seals, before humans built a safe area for their "children" to play mountain lions, bears, wolfs, coyotes, and other predators, would stalk hunt and kill/eat the seals. that is why they normally live on rocks away from harm. why don't the seals hang out at the shores, windansea, blacks, marine st, the cove????? possibly people/predators. (i'm confused)

[dgax65]

Good point on the trust being the last will and testament. I agree.

Does the city realize it is called the children's pool?

During the public testimony, I noticed that the seal huggers were very careful to call it Casa Beach instead of Children's Pool. They don't even want to concede that it has been used as a swimming area for children for decades.

[cioppino]

We all know that the city voted to keep the seals and amend the trust. Only our La Jolla rep Sherri Lightner wanted to get rid of the pollution and seals. Now we have to hope the Scripps family does what it promised and sues the crap out of our moronic city. Unfortunately its our money not the council members that will be wasted in all this. Anyway this thing is far from over. Just read this in the opinion section. Gives a bit of insight as to where they are going next.
Here is a quote by one of the Seal Huggers Robert Johnson. The group is now going after La Jolla Cove.

"We want La Jolla Cove designated as California sea lion habitat. We want lifeguards to stop chasing the sea lions off the Cove beach in the mornings and we want a rope erected to protect the area of the beach where the sea lions congregate in the mornings.
If the city council is to declare Casa beach as harbor seal habitat, we want the same done at the La Jolla Cove for the California sea lions. We thank Scripps Institution of Oceanography researchers for the help they have given us on this project."

They want it all for their use only. This group is of the same mindset as the MLPA wackos, they do not like fisherman or people for that matter. Its amazing the lies they try and get over on the public. The Srcipps family does not support the use of the Childrens Pool/Casa Beach as a seal rookery. They have threatened to sue the city over this issue, not support it.

The fact that the MLPAs and the Childrens pool issue are coming at us at the same time only shows how organized and motivated these environwackos are. We gotta do more!

[Tman]

"Can you legally hunt and kill sea lions?"

Best Answer - Chosen by Asker

I live in Alaska. The answer is a great big YES. It just floors me that 18 so called 'Experts' here at YA have no clue. Why did they even bother answering if they did not know the answer? Duh.

Both Alaskan and Canadian native peoples can legally hunt these animals. They are required to use all parts of the animal - which they have always done in the past - but it is part of the current Marine Mamal Protection Act verbage.

Under the MMPA indigenous people can hunt seals, walrus etc providing the use the meat and hide. Frequently the meat is eaten locally, the hides are tanned and used to make a number of expensive, and very pretty, waterproof garments. The skulls, tusks and teeth are ivory - this is where current ivory comes from for scrimshaw and other artistic uses - like musical instruments.

Seals, harbor and Stellar, and walrus population in Alaska and Canada are not in any peril. Although big scale harvesting has been stopped - only because of the decline in the fur market - we are close getting to the stage where the government might have to intervine and cull the populations at tax payer expense for the greater good of the animals well being.

What goes around - comes around. People don't like killing seals - so they don't buy seal products. Now your tax money will soon be going to killing seals so they do not overpopulate their habitat. Yup - those tree huggers are one smart group - good thing they don't pay taxes - so they can have a clean conscious.

Here' the link... http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20090101154458AAkgReT

Anybody have any Alaskan friends/relatives who want to come for a visit?:sifone:

[dorf]

"Can you legally hunt and kill sea lions?"

Best Answer - Chosen by Asker

I live in Alaska. The answer is a great big YES. It just floors me that 18 so called 'Experts' here at YA have no clue. Why did they even bother answering if they did not know the answer? Duh.

Both Alaskan and Canadian native peoples can legally hunt these animals. They are required to use all parts of the animal - which they have always done in the past - but it is part of the current Marine Mamal Protection Act verbage...

Anybody have any Alaskan friends/relatives who want to come for a visit?:sifone:
From reading this I would understand that it is in Alaska only.
If it is legal here in California you would think that someone from Viejas would look at this as a gold mine for the Casino/Outlet Mall. They could open a jewlery shop with all of the ivory harvested in La Jolla. I would buy a pair of sealskin waders. And BBQ Seal on a stick sounds mighty tasty.

[Zed]

Not legal "hunting" but legal culling in OR.
http://marinelife.about.com/b/2009/02/28/sea-lions-vs-salmon-in-oregon.htm

Money talks. The Humane Society is pretty big but they came up short against the salmon lobby and a Fed judge.

edit, to specify the difference. Cp = seals OR = sea lions. But you knew that.

[TXyakker]

This stuff just makes me angry. :mad: I'm getting ready to move back to Texas for my next set of orders, and as much as i'm going to miss the fishing in La Jolla chasing :yt:, I'm so happy to get out of this state and away from these kind of people. I just dont get how people become so dumb and brainwashed to think the way they do, I wish natural selection worked a little more in our favor....:hmmmm: I mean, seals/animals are waaaaaaay more important than people, so we should just let them take over where we like to hang out right?

[prowlerdude]

Humane Society of the USA has been associated with eco-terrorists. So has the head of the save the seals. Gonna be funny someday when this washes out and all the politicians that cozzied up to them are hung out to dry. Google these kooks...

http://www.activistcash.com/organization_overview.cfm?oid=136

http://www.activistcash.com/organization_overview.cfm?oid=21

http://www.activistcash.com/biography.cfm?bid=3247

http://arfacts.wordpress.com/2008/04/16/peta-hsus-followers-wake-up-your-supporting-killers/

[dsafety]

TXYakker's comment got my juices stiring. +

I consider myself an environmentalist, but I totally agree with his point of view on this subject. The problem is that whenever people take up an extreme position, on just about any issue, they get out of touch with the majority. Sure, there are some occasions when a small minority of vocal people with a minority view can convince the majority to the wisdom of their point of view and change the world. The public's change in their support for the Vietnam and Iraq wars over time are good examples of the kind of changes that dedicated advocates can accomplish if their mission is righteous.

The idea of settting aside traditional swimming beaches in La Jolla for the use of seals, (not native to the area, by the way), that were rescued by Sea World, simply does not past the reasonability test. Our politicians are so obcessed with winning re-election, that most of them rarely turn their brain on when it comes to sensitive issues. The simply wet their fingers and stick them in the air to see which way the popular winds are blowing.

I was a lifeguard at both the Casa and the Cove years ago when people, (remember them), were the main visitors at these beaches. It would be a very sad day indeed if human usage of these two treasures is forbidden. I, for one, would happily join the revolution to overthrow those who make these kinds of stupid decisions.

Bob

[FISHIONADO]

I'm a conservationist, not a preservationist, typically. However, on this particular topic I have a different point of view from most of the anti-seal people. I raised my kids in La Jolla and we never went to the children's pool even when it was open. La Jolla Shores and Scripps were always so much better. If you ask the children to vote they would choose to let the seals stay. Every day there are hundreds of people and lots of kids who enjoy watching the seals. Not many people really used the children's pool when it was open. I definitely support keeping the north kelp open for recreational fishing but I don't really care what happens to the children's pool. We have so many right-wing take all for profit types we need some left-wing save the earth types to balance things out. Without the Sierra Club Yosemite would be full of condos, Chili's, and Starbucks. Peace all.

[cioppino]

I'm a conservationist, not a preservationist, typically. However, on this particular topic I have a different point of view from most of the anti-seal people. I raised my kids in La Jolla and we never went to the children's pool even when it was open. La Jolla Shores and Scripps were always so much better. If you ask the children to vote they would choose to let the seals stay. Every day there are hundreds of people and lots of kids who enjoy watching the seals. Not many people really used the children's pool when it was open. I definitely support keeping the north kelp open for recreational fishing but I don't really care what happens to the children's pool. We have so many right-wing take all for profit types we need some left-wing save the earth types to balance things out. Without the Sierra Club Yosemite would be full of condos, Chili's, and Starbucks. Peace all.


Fishanado, this isnt about being anti seal. Its about taking away our rights to a public beach that was trusted to the Children of this city. You want someone fucking with your will or trust? What good is a legal document if eight dipshits from the city can just re-write it to suit their needs.

My relatives are fortunate enough to live near the cross. I was up there visiting today and my Uncle mentioned to me how upset his neighbor was that Sherri Lightner voted to get rid of the seals. Apparently when Lightner was campaining her initial reaction was to support the seals and now that she actuals understands the issue she supports the Children. Anyhow this wacko rich ass single lady with no kids is also planning on leaving all, and all is a lot, of her money to help save stray fucking cats. How about helping out stray starving human beings. Crazy wacked out loaner and her cats. Pathetic.

Oh well I get to take out all my frustrations on the sweet little furbags in Alaska. I commercial fish there for a month each year. Any seal comes and fucks with our gear and its time to break out the SKS. Damn things are a lot harder to hit than you would think. We do get a few now and then as do the other commercial guys. Funny how the seal population up there is just fine. Only difference is they tend be a lot more boat shy.

[Tman]

I raised my kids in La Jolla and we never went to the children's pool even when it was open. La Jolla Shores and Scripps were always so much better. If you ask the children to vote they would choose to let the seals stay. Every day there are hundreds of people and lots of kids who enjoy watching the seals. Not many people really used the children's pool when it was open.

Good to hear something like that from a local.
Fact is, seals never used to be around there. I respect your comments, though I tend to disagree simply for the fact that, as the adage goes, give someone an inch and they'll take a mile.

When I used to frequent CP, no seals and plenty of kids. Plus the added beauty of the diversity since you had small reefs mixed with sand bottom created an opportunity to view anything from small sharks, bugs, to calicos.

I don't know how old your kids were, I used to take chicas there who never knew the beauty below them, and most of these girls were lifeguards!

Now, as a parent of a future waterman, I always hoped to be able to take him snorkeling early at a place that would allow him to view the sea with no aggression, fish that were not skittish, a place with diversity, different structure, and not a flat sandy bottom.

I guess the thing that irritates me more than anything is not only the thought that my son will never be able to see CP as I saw it before, the sea life, alive, fish everywhere, but that a single person had the vision to make it a safe haven for children, spent her money and time to create it, only to have a group come along with no regard for the beauties and bounties of our oceans, who just want to sit out of the way, with binos and cameras, and marvel at these creatures on the sand, not knowing the true destruction they've created in the water, the polluted waters, and the loss of fish and habitat, that will take years to recover.

It's funny, and very sad, that these same people, had they spent the time to enjoy the undersea life, the feeling of cold ocean water in the morning, the soothing feeling of the water on a hot day, replenishing, the euphoric feeling of swimming with the denizens of the ocean and to marvel at their beauty, again, had they spent the time to enjoy this side of nature, I don't think they would want the seals there and would realize the destruction they are causing.

To them, the beauty is standing on the ledges, the looking spots, and watching the seals on the sand, frolicking in the ocean. They aren't in the water, or on the water, to see where the real beauty lies. Nor are they able to see the destruction caused over a few years' time....

[Tman]

Fishanado, this isnt about being anti seal. Its about taking away our rights to a public beach that was trusted to the Children of this city. You want someone fooking with your will or trust? What good is a legal document if eight dipshits from the city can just re-write it to suit their needs.

wow....very well said, even better than mine.:you_rock::luxhello::notworthy:
Trusted to the children of this city. By someone who spent alot of their MONEY and TIME to make this happen.

Look at it this way...

A great, beautiful building that holds many, many treasures, be they art or books, is not structurally sound. But the treasures inside cannot be removed.

Do you still admire the beauty of the building, knowing it will soon collapse and the treasures inside will be lost, or do you find a way to repair the building so the treasures inside could still be seen as they were meant to be?

[FISHIONADO]

Not many people used the Children's Pool when it was open. A few senior citizens in speedos was all I ever saw there. Now hundreds of people visit it every day. The children want the seals, ask them. This is just a silly issue for talk radio to rant about. Seals not native to San Diego? Planted there by Sea World? Got data to back that up?

I hope we can have these debates without people reducing it to name calling and foul language.

[cioppino]

Not many people used the Children's Pool when it was open. A few senior citizens in speedos was all I ever saw there. Now hundreds of people visit it every day. The children want the seals, ask them. This is just a silly issue for talk radio to rant about. Seals not native to San Diego? Planted there by Sea World? Got data to back that up?

I hope we can have these debates without people reducing it to name calling and foul language.

I have been in San Diego my entire life and I have to totally dissagree with you about the lack of use of the Childrens pool. As kids our parents would take us there becasue the Cove was always packed on the weekend. The Childrens pool was always crowded as well. Maybe youre talking about winter or something.

When is the last time kids made any reasonable decisions? I do not like hearing people say that the children want the seals there! Thats ridiculous! If it were up to the children all us parents would have a seal at the dinner table, gimme a break!

Given the choice to use the beach and to go snorkel and look at fish I know which my two children would rather do. Watching stuff is great, but participation is much more fun.

[FISHIONADO]

I do not like hearing people say that the children want the seals there!

Because you don't like it doesn't change things. You probably won't like it when I say that I disagree with having a Christian symbol (actually a roman torture device) representing a war memorial on Soledad. I'm a veteran and not religious and would prefer a statue of a soldier.

Don't be hating, just accept that many people have different opinions from yours and figure out how to get along.

[Dan]

Dave whats next? You gonna say we should teach Evolution in schools?!! :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Seals or no seals, let's do whatever it takes to get those old hags up on the bluffs to stop selling Tshirts to the sympathetic tourists for big profits.

[cioppino]

Because you don't like it doesn't change things. You probably won't like it when I say that I disagree with having a Christian symbol (actually a roman torture device) representing a war memorial on Soledad. I'm a veteran and not religious and would prefer a statue of a soldier.

Don't be hating, just accept that many people have different opinions from yours and figure out how to get along.

Not HATING anybody. I also dont have to accept your difference of opinion when you are wrong. This isnt about opinions, its about FACTS.

Given all the information on this topic people are going to side with the original trust. The seal huggers throw out little pieces of false information to help move their cause along misleading their captive audience of TOURISTS. (BTW nobody has booked a flight to San Diego to just see the seals at the Childrens Pool. Those tourists are going to be in the area with or without seals) Like stating that the Scripps family supports the seals being there. They do not and are going to sue the city and waste a bunch of my tax dollars.

Go ahead and do a little survey from many different children. Ask them if they would rather watch the seals from a distance, or go down to that very same beach, which was CREATED for them, and play in the sand and swim in the ocean. Strange how the five children I just talked to chose to play in the sand and in the ocean versus watching some seals. They must be seal HATERS.

Funny how seal huggers and the like pitch our difference of opinion as HATE for them and the seals. Its a simplistic diversionary tactic to avoid to simple truth of this situation. Its not about seals or what you or I think is right. Its about a very simple fact. The Childrens Pool was created for the Children. The only reason the city council voted to keep it as its current polluted state is so they wouldnt be spending money the city does not currently have to clean up the beach. If there were a surplus of money in the local budget this would not be an issue.

The Federal government which already told the city to clean that beach up and honor the trust is not going to like it when they find out what the city has done. Just look at the Medicinal Marijuana bull. A city may say its legal to sell Marijuana and even let its citizens do that. However the Federal Government does not care about what the city says is legal or not. They still arrest people selling the dope and put them in jail.
So I expect that all this discussion is for not. This is only buying the seal huggers and the city more time. Soon enough the Scripps family will sue the city, get this issue back in superior court, where any judge is going to honor the previous judges decision telling the city to honor the trust, clean up the beach, and get rid of the seals.

Remember what you said about name calling. I am not a HATER! :D

[Billy V]

The children don't pay the taxes, and are not voters. If you were to ask a child who they wanted for president you may get Mickey Mouse as an answer.

So as a responsible parent I would take their request to "see the seals" into consideration, and shuffle them over to Sea World.

As for the Children's Pool Vs The Scripps Trust Issue, I would stand solidly on the side of the laws that allowed the creation of the Trust.

The Trust intentions were clear, and created for the benefit of the people and children of San Diego, not as a wildlife sanctuary.

Its OK to be different, but don't think your differences gives you the right to impose your ways onto others. Especially in the case of a Trust, or Will where its intentions were clear.
-------------------------------
The date stamp on this picture is correct.
It depicts "Actual Children" using The Children's Pool for its intended use.
http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47b8d938b3127ccec4f3b6814d2c00000040O00AbMmzFizcN2 IPbz4M/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D720/ry%3D480/

http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47b8d938b3127ccec4f38c344d8400000060O00AbMmzFizcN2 IPbz4M/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D720/ry%3D480/

[Dave I.]

I'm not a native, so not a Voter.

Back in 1994 to 1998, I swam at the children's pool. Tons of Children were there at the same time.


Dave

[bellcon]

just curious
whats with the sign in the last picture
"please do not go on the beach"

whats the rest of it say?
thanks

[dsafety]

With due respect to Fishionado's opinion, I have to strongly say that he is dead wrong. I grew up in La Jolla. When I was a kid, the Casa was the place that all the kids went, especially those who loved snorkeling and prowling the tide pools. I was one of those kids. Human visitation only stopped when the politicians got involved.

I remember Christmas day 19 sixty-something. The only thing I asked for that year was a wet suit so I could snorkel year round. Santa delivered and Christmas day my parents took me to the Casa to try out my new gear.

The water was in the mid 50's but I didn't care. I put on my suit and jumpped in. I remember swimming along the big rock next to the seawall, (this rock is now mostly covered with sand). The first creature I saw was a seal lion pup, (not a seal, BTW). With its mom watching from a safe distance this pup and I swam together for a long time. I will never forget that day.

Seals and people can coexist. My guess is if the Casa is returned to its original condition, and people are allowed back on the beach, the seals will simply move back to Seal Rock a couple hundred yards away where they hung out when I was a kid. The will probably have to share the space with the native seal lions but since they do that in nature all the time, I cannot see that there will be a problem.

One of the problems here is that the people making the decisions on this subject do not have the wisdom that comes from many years of observing this site and the creatures that live there.

Bob

[Tman]

With due respect to Fishionado's opinion, I have to strongly say that he is dead wrong. I grew up in La Jolla. When I was a kid, the Casa was the place that all the kids went, especially those who loved snorkeling and prowling the tide pools. I was one of those kids. Human visitation only stopped when the politicians got involved.

I remember Christmas day 19 sixty-something. The only thing I asked for that year was a wet suit so I could snorkel year round. Santa delivered and Christmas day my parents took me to the Casa to try out my new gear.

The water was in the mid 50's but I didn't care. I put on my suit and jumpped in. I remember swimming along the big rock next to the seawall, (this rock is now mostly covered with sand). The first creature I saw was a seal lion pup, (not a seal, BTW). With its mom watching from a safe distance this pup and I swam together for a long time. I will never forget that day.

Seals and people can coexist. My guess is if the Casa is returned to its original condition, and people are allowed back on the beach, the seals will simply move back to Seal Rock a couple hundred yards away where they hung out when I was a kid. The will probably have to share the space with the native seal lions but since they do that in nature all the time, I cannot see that there will be a problem.

One of the problems here is that the people making the decisions on this subject do not have the wisdom that comes from many years of observing this site and the creatures that live there.

Bob

:luxhello::luxhello::luxhello:

That's what we needed to hear, and that is the reason I want to see it returned to how it was meant to be...
For my son to be able to enjoy it, just as you did.

Thank you for that post.

[Billy V]

just curious
whats with the sign in the last picture
"please do not go on the beach"

whats the rest of it say?
thanks

Those are the bullshit signs the Seal Watch Terrorists place along side of The Official City of San Diego sign.

Here is a closer look. The Official Sign is on the right --->
http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47b8d938b3127ccec4f2bd7c2d0000000040O00AbMmzFizcN2 IPbz4M/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D720/ry%3D480/

[Tman]

Those are the bullshit signs the Seal Watch Terrorists place along side of The Official City of San Diego sign.

Here is a closer look. The Official Sign is on the right --->
http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47b8d938b3127ccec4f2bd7c2d0000000040O00AbMmzFizcN2 IPbz4M/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D720/ry%3D480/

What happened to this sign....

http://www.bigwatersedge.com/bwegallery/data/500/seals.jpg

[FISHIONADO]

I really don't care about this silly little issue other than the enjoyment of watching folks on both sides of the issues rant. I'm not going to use the pool either way and neither will most of the people ranting. I hope you folks put as much energy into worrying about our financially broke city, state, and fed as you do this issue.

To support children the pool requires frequent maintenance to remove the sand that fills the pool and blocks the drains. How about you children huggers step up and pay for it rather than expect my tax dollars to pay for it? :)

Sorry this issue cause some of you folks so much angst. The bigger issues in life must make you suicidal.

[j mo]

For those that DO care
http://www.friendsofthechildrenspool.com/

FRIENDS OF THE CHILDEN’S POOL is organized to:
EDUCATE the public as to the use of the Children’s Pool in accord with Miss Ellen Scripps charitable intent in 1931 in order to protect La Jolla Children’s Pool surroundings as a public park, a bathing pool for children and public recreational usage in accordance with chapter 937 of the attached deed of trust between Miss Ellen Browning Scripps, the State of California and the City of San Diego, county of San Diego.

[dsafety]

To support children the pool requires frequent maintenance to remove the sand that fills the pool and blocks the drains. How about you children huggers step up and pay for it rather than expect my tax dollars to pay for it? :)



Agan, Mr. Fishionado is incorrect. I have been around the Casa for more than 50 years. As far as I know, it has never been dredged. Assuming that everything goes according to plan, it will be dredged for the first time as part of the mandated reclamation effort.

As for other maintenance, the City is currently spending a big chunk of change to restore the restrooms and lifeguard tower that are falling apart. This is the first major maintenance that this site has undergone ever. This maintenance is long overdue.

Why, you may ask is there a lifeguard station on a beach that does not currently allow human swimmers. That is a good question. This site is the main year-round lifeguard facility for the entire La Jolla rock beach area. This facility covers the entire coast from Bird Rock to the caves north of the Cove. The lifeguards working out of the Casa are the ones who keep an eye on kayak fishers and divers in the kelp beds. They would also be there to protect any swimmers in the CP, if people are ever allowed to return.

Finally, at the risk of extending the arguement, I am proud to be called a "children hugger". I think my kids kind of enjoy it. I just wish that they could also enjoy the some personal freedoms and access to nature that I experienced when I was their age. Sadly, it seems that every year there are more rules and restrictions placed upon us. This is not a good thing.

Bob

[Tman]

Well said...thank you. :luxhello:

CP was the first spot I wanted to intro my son to free diving, aka snorkeling. Easy access, no obstructions.

As it stands, I will have to take him to my bug spot, S of CP, not as easy of a dive, and more rocks (obstacles) instead of the smooth sand entry.

Sunset Cliffs? ya right
LJ shores? Leopards, he has swam with them, but nothing else.
Cardiff? Great flat, which is rare, not even safe at low tide.
Swamis? ya right

Think that about covers the coast without endangering him too much....that's my reason for seeing CP as it should be.

And yes, if I could control where my tax $ went, safe to say where it would be spent...

[FISHIONADO]

I was mistaken on the dredging, I remembered an article about the original construction that talked about the drains being designed poorly and assumed... I know.

Proud to be a children hugger? Holy crap that is funny. If you take everything I say seriously you are missing the sarcasm.

[dsafety]

Tman, if you are looking for a great place for snorkeling with your kid where he can see lots of cool stuff, try the bay north of Big Rock in Bird Rock. There is a fairly easy rock access near the point on the north side.

That was my "secret" place as a kid. In the day you could get a limit of abs in 10 minutes. These days the abalone are gone but there are still plenty of fish, crabs and other intersting things. Go at low tide when it is shallow. The water there gets dirty with any kind of surf however.

Bob

[Tman]

Know the area very well...last ab I got was just S of there back in the day, buried under a ledge.

Low tide is best, but I'm still worried about the undercurrent, you know what I mean. Good place at low tide to scavenge, but not for a beginner youth. Conditions would have to be ideal, otherwise, scrape, scrape, scrape...

BTW, that is the best spot to find;) buoys too, after the swells...