The IPA maps

[tylerdurden]

Since everyone is asking exactly what got recommended, here are the IPA maps in the disputed regions. I only put up maps in kayak interested areas. This is not the whole array of closures. I didn't put up the Laguna map since I don't know the area that well and I think they moved the boundaries a little bit and the marine map version isn't updated yet.

All this information is unofficial. Just what I understood from the meeting. I hope this clears up any confusion about what exactly was proposed.

Doom, I mean Dume:
No useful H&L in the blue. They changed the boundary between the blue and red a little bit, but it doesn't really matter since no useful fishing is allowed for us anyways.

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r203/evilclone619/Dume.jpg

PV:
http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r203/evilclone619/PV.jpg

Swamis/Encinitas, no H&L fishing in this one.
http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r203/evilclone619/Swamis.jpg

LJ
http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r203/evilclone619/LJtotal.jpg

The south reserve starts at about Winamar Street at Wind and Sea, and almost goes to Crystal pier. The blue area is supposed to allow pelagic take.
http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r203/evilclone619/LJsouth.jpg

The blue area along Blacks Beach allows bait to be caught only.
http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r203/evilclone619/LJandScripps.jpg

Literally cutting the Scripps Pier in half
http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r203/evilclone619/MLPAproposed.jpg

For comparison, the old and new LJ boundaries:
http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r203/evilclone619/LJscrippswithsubstrateshown.jpg

[so cal shaggy]

Laguna got royally thrown under the bus to make up what they did not take in PV


http://www.bigwatersedge.com/bwevb/[IMG]http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e53/shaggyman/Lagunaoption.jpghttp://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e53/shaggyman/Lagunaoption.jpg

[Tman]

Thanks for that Tyler

LJ N of Scripps, we get phooked...any guys who fish the area care to respond?

Looking at Swamis N, bug trappers get phooked.

Plan to fish Cardiff? Drag the fish S to the 'free' space.

LJ S ? Only to a certain spot, they do manage to wipe out the shallow water spots.

Incredible. Let's see how they enforce the regs at night during bug season in the shallow areas that produce the best at S LJ/N PB.

There has got to be some sort of compromise in those areas, and a compromise N of Scripps. If the boaters can't get in tight to those areas and only yakkers and spearos can, clarify then. Make amends.

Yakkers and spearos will not damage/interfere/compromise/affect the natural habitat...and will not disrupt. Our catch is limited to our capacity.

We need to and will inform the DFG of this...

[Afran]

My be-loved La Jolla & Scripps. Where I have spent most of my life in the waters.

Sad day.









Keep fishing guys.

[tylerdurden]

Which one of those Laguna shapes did they take? The one further to the south I thought?


My be-loved La Jolla & Scripps. Where I have spent most of my life in the waters.

Sad day.


All the best shore fishing too. We can still lobby the DFG commission to allow shore fishing as I beleive the level of protection would still be unchanged. I think I forgot to mention shore fishing in my public comments for this area.

[lambadmin]

tragedy :(

[DESTROYER]

I guess The Steve Moyer Memorial Tournament will have to be won off the point in 2010. Ridiculous! Thanks Tyler, those are nice images.

[robmandel]

for you guys that don't fish malibu much, that red area on the top map (just west of the big point) is what we kept referring to as BKR (big kelp reef). it is our LJ. it is a jewel. other than yellowtail, we get everything from great bassin, to halibut, to wsb, to rockfish, and all sorts of fun stuff. (with a much shorter paddle and relatively calmer waters) and it's been completely stolen. I'm typing this at 1am as I still can't sleep. I'm sick to my stomach and just lay there tossing and turning. just sick, angered, disgusted.

it seems almost surreal. I still can't believe what happened. I started kayak fishing a little over 4 years ago, and that was pretty much my main fishing area. I could have never imagined something like this would have happened. not in this country. but it did.

we gotta keep the fight going. the dfg has to be good start. the courts? there's no way they can constitutionally bar citizens from fishing public waters. or so you'd think. maybe not any more.

[so cal shaggy]

Which one of those Laguna shapes did they take? The one further to the south I thought?
They did the boundary is at the southern end of Crystal Cove and stretches through the entire of Laguna so they got what they wanted an end to end closure :mad:

[Fiskadoro]

for you guys that don't fish malibu much, that red area on the top map (just west of the big point) is what we kept referring to as BKR (big kelp reef). it is our LJ. it is a jewel. other than yellowtail, we get everything from great bassin, to halibut, to wsb, to rockfish, and all sorts of fun stuff. (with a much shorter paddle and relatively calmer waters) and it's been completely stolen. I'm typing this at 1am as I still can't sleep. I'm sick to my stomach and just lay there tossing and turning. just sick, angered, disgusted......

Actually some years you can catch Yellows outside of BKR though it's been a few years since I have fished them.

They come through and blow up on bait as they make there way up the coast to the Channel Islands. Basically anything you can catch at the Channel Islands you can catch off BKR, as it has similar conditions and the fish consistently pass through there, and feed as they move through. It definitely is the best fishing we have up here in the LA area, our La Jolla and they just took it all.

Rocky is over rated as it get's hammered by the Redondo Half day boats, and private botaers from King Harbor. It's going to stay open but they are closing my two favorite local spots: BKR and Point Vicente and the other point next to it down by the old Marineland.

Honestly in my opinion that area they are now closing at PV is a better place to fish then Rocky and a favorite spot of mine for Big Halibut Yellowtail and Seabass.

Here's a yellow I got there a while back:
http://www.allcoast.com/photos/data/500/100343oldyeller2295.JPG
and a legal C-bass I got there that same day:
http://img130.imageshack.us/img130/8505/cbass.jpg

I've caught more Yellows there then anywhere local to LA, both breezing fish outside and tight to the kelp. Most people do not even know they are there.

They say it's a trade off but it's not an even trade.

They just closed my favorite local Yellowtail spot, my favorite local big Halibut spot, and the only two kelp areas where I personally have taken legal Seabass locally near LA since back in 2001.

It's been almost a decade since I got a Seabass off Rocky Point. Rocky may traditionally be good fishing but for the last few years BKR has easily been ten times the fishery for C-bass that Rocky has been.

That's just been kept a secret. Since does not receive any sport boat pressure, and it's too far from MDR and Oxnard to make it worth while for the fleets from those harbors, and the Kayakers usual keep it quite about the fishing there, the word rarely get's out when the fish are there.

My three biggest concerns all along when it came to closures were La Jolla, Rocky Point, and BKR. BKR was the area with the least overall pressure and the least sportboat pressure, and the best fishing local to LA.... What a coincidence that it is the one that will now be completely closed to us.

I know the closures at la Jolla s#ck but if you guys got reemed they ripped us a new one.

At least they left some prime fishing open down there off the point, they just took it all away from us at Dume.

I heard Meg Caldwell on NPR tonight talking about how there was a compromise between fisherman and environmentalists and though both sides would of preferred some changes the outcome reflects a consensus that meets the needs of both sides, and is a victory for all because all interests worked together.

What a load of sh!t. There was no compromise or consensus when it came to Dume and BKR they just took it all and did not listen to a thing we had to say about it, and now on top of that they want to pretend like we went along with it or our voice was heard.

That's the way it works in politics, give those with the power and money what they want and then pretend everyone (including the little guy that got burned) is happy for the cameras..

Jim

[SeaDog]

What are the restrictions on the blue areas in OC?

[Royak]

[QUOTE=Tman;47173]LJ N of Scripps, we get phooked...any guys who fish the area care to respond?QUOTE]

I fish there a lot, mostly for quality YT. Usually on my skiff, but sometimes on my kayak. Bait only?! So we paddle (or power) to the Scripps pier to make bait, then go -- how many miles? -- to use it. What ever happened to the "green" agenda (e.g. saving fuel and energy)? This is bullshit and serves no rational purpose.

[LORENZ]

You guys use a langauge that's all your own. Talk like a normal guy and the normal guy would be more prone to help out.

Blue means
Red means
H&L is

[Holy Mackerel]

You guys use a langauge that's all your own. Talk like a normal guy and the normal guy would be more prone to help out.

Blue means
Red means
H&L is

where the hell you been all year? :D

BLUE = STATE MARINE CONSERVATION AREA (SMCA) limited-specific take

RED = STATE MARINE RESERVE (SMR) NO TAKE

H&L = HOOK AND LINE

[tylerdurden]

The IPA has been added to marinemap. Lets us look at the maps in detail.

http://marinemap.org/marinemap/

Then click on MPAs, Arrays, Proposals
Then Click on MLPA SouthCoast Integrated Preferred Alternative (IPA)

It is about the 10th one on the list.

Red means no fishing, no take. Take a hike.
To find out what is allowed in a blue area, click it and see the allowed uses or read the text that comes up.

Try not to puke.

[screaming reel]

So for Scripps it says allow the take of coastal pelagic fin fish. Does that mean YT? Sounds like it does.

[kurt]

No, coastal pelagics are sardines, mackerel, anchovies. Bait. Unless DFG has changed their definition of coastal pelagic, yellowtail fall under pelagic.

[tylerdurden]

Kurt has it right.
Costal pelagic means bait.
Sardine, anchovy, mac, smelt, squid. I think that is about it.

Pelagic is different.

The Scripps SMCA allows bait only by hook and line as it is proposed now.

[LORENZ]

Here's another pissed off moment.

I've gone to the shops, I've asked around in the normal places a guy would ask around about fishing junk. The shop folk were more ignorant than I on the subject.

"Go on the web" was a common theme. The most knowledgeable folks who were coherent were the weekend fishing shows. 1 in particular, and even those guys made my ears bleed. Simple questions like what areas are being closed turned into 5 minute rants.

I'll be the first to say, that these maps were the clearest most accessible info on the closures that I've found. I think I'm talking for the majority of fisherman. It's been pretty hard to figure out what's going on when you spend a couple minutes here and there to keep abreast of the fight.

[Holy Mackerel]

I've been working all year. That's what working class slobs do.

This is the heart of the problem. Normal folks work and don't have time to deal with the take over of Democrats and Enviros.

yeah, I am a bum with all kinds of free time. ;)

[screaming reel]

On google earth it looks as though the scripps reserve will end around Blacks proper. So it appears that north blacks and torry are still in the fishable zone. Am I right to assume this?

[Dan]

Does north blacks stop at bathtub rock or the at the mussle rocks right before you get into nicked land.

post the map your talking about.

http://southcoast.marinemap.org/marinemap/

once it opens, click: MPAs, Arrays, and Proposals

go nine boxes down and click the box.

then, drill down by clicking on the map till you get to Scripps.

You'll see that the new reserve extends from the Pier to one mile north, which is just shy of the trail down from glider port. So if you like to fish nude, you're all set. If, on the otherhand you like to fish from your kayak in that area you're fucked.

[FISHIONADO]

I'm grumpy and pissed off but after reading the stuff above I can see how difficult it is to learn about this stuff if you just now heard about it. Without following this fishing board I probably would not have had visibility to the bullshit we just saw and would not have attended the BTRF and Surfrider and City Council meetings.

Dsafety was dead-on with his last post.

[lamb]

Tyler thanks for putting the maps and info up...

It is a real tragedy, but such a concise info in one place helps... if nothing else - get more easily depressed. :o

Please easy with political bs popaganda... it's boring, and has nothing to do with MLPA.

[tylerdurden]

Thanks guys. You forgot Paul, MJ and the rest of our RSG members. They spent more time on this than any of us "civilians" that got involved.

dsafety hit it right on.

I am frustrated that even after putting up the info people want to know, and the maps and tools to figure things out, people are too lazy to do it themselves. A quick google search or search of these message boards will answer most questions anyone has. This apathy and lack of motivation is a big part of what got us into the mess we are in now. Too few people willing to sacrifice some of their own time to find out what is going on and ensure a better fishing future. Too few only care now that the final map has been proposed and it is awful, when it might be too late to make the big changes they now demand. Too many people waste time on fishing message boards arguing about useless shit and asking questions like "how do I catch a fish?" instead of working in a constructive way on this MLPA issue. Now that the process is entering the endgame, it is maddening to hear people come in late in the game saying they wished they could have helped, but they have a job and no time. We needed your participation 8 months ago. We still need it now, but we can't help but wonder where you have been the last year. The MLPA posts on all the fishing boards has been hard to miss, not to mention the fliers at tackle shops, landings etc.

All of us that got involved in the MLPA process have jobs, families, and other things we would like to spend time on. We all spent vacation time, sick time, and unpaid time off to make a difference. We got involved because the result will directly effect our lives. I would argue that whether McCain or Obama is president will have less of a direct effect on most of our lives than the closure of LJ, PV, or Malibu would. I still can't understand why so many of us, with so much at stake did nothing. I remember the gist of a quote that struck me as relevant to this. "We will remember not only the people out to get us, but the good people that did nothing and let it happen."

It's not too late to make a difference. Stay tuned to the boards for more info. It's not over, but we are closer to the end than the start.

[Billy V]

It also makes me crazy to hear people come on this site asking MLPA Questions like they have been living On The Moon for the Past Year

-Please don't think you have a valid excuse because You Had To Work.
So did everybody else, just ask the guys who have no Vacation Time left for the Entire Year. Or guys who took off from work without pay for many of the meetings.

Unless you were dealing with a Medical Emergency, as some of us were, there is really no excuse.
-Unless I was sending Flowers to Your Funeral.-That would be a Valid Excuse.

We did everything possible including Bussing People to the Meetings for FREE, and sent them home with a Free Half Day Voucher for San Diego Sport Fishing Boats.

We literally printed and distributed Thousands of fliers like this. Up and Down the South Coast. Our brothers from Baytubers and Spearboard did the same. Tackle stores, launch ramps, Kayak Launch Sites, and more.

http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47b9cf01b3127ccef8fc8d03832300000030O00AbMmzFizcN2 IPbz4M/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D720/ry%3D480/
Read the Top Left Corner
http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47b9cf01b3127ccef8fd5ff2a3f700000030O00AbMmzFizcN2 IPbz4M/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D720/ry%3D480/

[Tman]

Relax Billy, you're no longer the Bully...you've been DETHRONED...
:D:D:D:eek:

http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47b9cf01b3127ccef8fd5ff2a3f700000030O00AbMmzFizcN2 IPbz4M/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D720/ry%3D480/

Wow...what sucks is that I actually remember those meetings...time flies when you're getting :reddy:

[Matt]

And for the record EVERYONE SHOULD BE BITTER about being eaten alive and degraded by people who had the deck stacked from the beginning!!! IF YOU AREN'T ANGRY ABOUT IT I gotta say you apparently are on their side! All of the fish below are in the 30's and all were taken in a now banned area so YEAH I AM WAY ANGRY! If you didn't go to the meetings you may very well have missed your chance to consistently catch large YT in one of the now banned areas.....hope your stoked !!!!

[dsafety]

OK now... enough said.

Next subject:

Anyone for giving La Jolla a try next Friday? I for one could use some tips on fishing with iron or fishing deep, (I would love to catch a ling.)

If anyone is interested, please post or PM.

Bob

[Tman]

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Junior

Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 26
http://www.bigwatersedge.com/bwevb/images/misc/im_aim.gif (http://www.bigwatersedge.com/bwevb/showthread.php?p=21325#)



</TD><TD class=alt1 id=td_post_21325 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #ffffff 1px solid"><!-- message -->dorado, if that is the case, then I hope we never see reports from you again - keep your info to yourself and your pics and your reports and your advice. Anyone who has ever posted on the public fishing forums shares the blame for the increased fishing pressure at local spots. You have posted many times and draw in huge numbers of people to these spots. Post, post, post. Whine Whine Whine. Ha, Ha,Ha. - I don't get it.









</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>








Dang screamer...do not get me started...

What's the old saying?

"You find fault in others that which you see in yourself..."

You seem to have a blatant disrespect for those who offer advice, or who are trying to help others.

I cannot wait to read your response to this...and do not PM me, make it public...

[CurtyL]

high horses? on this forum? no way.

[Matt]

:D personally any horse is fairly high for me as I not that tall, I hope everyone is bitter that they may lose a fishing area, it is pointless to get bitter at one another we are all on the same side so knock it off everybody!!!(and that means me too)

Now smile and laugh and go catch a fish and like I said before name it "Meg" or "ken" or "evan" or any name that coincides with the true enemy being any of the anti-fishing groups! And I hope I get to meet everybody at the DFG commission meeting and that everyone sends letters that would be the best xmas present I could or any fisherman could ask for!:yt::wsb::lobster:oh and hell yea lobster icon! I am off to go fishing now hope to see some or all of you on the water!!!

[driftwood]

On google earth it looks as though the scripps reserve will end around Blacks proper. So it appears that north blacks and torry are still in the fishable zone. Am I right to assume this?


A wise man once told me, " If you think education is expensive and takes too much time try ignorance"

[Tman]

All you guys get off your high horses and relax.

Matt, I don't think they were talking about height of a person or height of a horse.

OK, I gotta come clean...many years ago, girlfriend and I Catherine, went down to Mex to do some camping. Place that had horses you could rent and ride down the beach...skinny fellas.
Well, one night after a buncha drinks, we decided to take a ride down the beach. After a while, we decided to dismount and have a few tokes.
Horses seemed to like the smell, so we aimed the exhales at their faces..never saw a horse smile before...
Rode back to the camp spot, and the ranchero said those exact same words...in Spanish of course..

'bájese de su caballo alto'

Good thing they had some hay for them, those dudes munched big time.

I don't know how you guys found out about this Screamer and CurtyL...wow.

I promise, that was the last time that I was on a high horse....

[CurtyL]

I thought you guys were talking about horses on acid.

[Matt]

Oh man old no. 6 with the unicorns on the paper.........uhhhhh nevermind!


Look at all the pretty colors...................

[-scallywag-]

Are you the same lorenz that does the dodge CTD's suspension kits? if you are, from one business owner to another, i would suggest not mixing political comments with your companies halfway respected name. And as others pointed out, this MLPA law and the MLPAI was put in place by a "Republican" office...go figure.

[Fiskadoro]

If the MLPA closures are put into effect as they are currently proposed, we will all lose something that we treasure dearly. I, for one, plan to do everything I can to keep this from happening....To those tireless folks who have been leading this fight, please keep the fire lit under the rest of us and make sure we know how best to help support the cause.

I hear that :iagree:

[tylerdurden]

Most websites like this have no politics rules for a reason. Many fishermen are Democrats and Republicans.

The only thing that is relevant in this discussion is the politics of the MLPA. Many Democrats, and Republicans are against us and for us.

Just a few. Someone else made a more complete list.

Against us
Governator (R)
DFG commissioner Benninghoven (R)
Christine Kehoe (D)


For us
Carl Demaio (R)
Sherri Lightner (D)
Nathan Fletcher (R)

[tylerdurden]

Lorenz,
You are not helping us here. Arguing over broad partisan politics gets us no where. We need to stay specific to the MLPA topic. I am sure there are politics boards to argue the broader point.

This argument has nothing to do with what is actually happening in a couple weeks. The question for all of us is what are we doing in the next couple days to make things better? This is not helping.

btw,
This board has an ignore user feature.

[tylerdurden]

Don't you get it yet. A letter isn't going to do a thing to convince a guy, if his mind is already made up...

Right...

Letters, public outreach to elected officials of both parties, and our PRESENCE at the meetings so far has done nothing to help the cause :rolleyes: .

This would have been way worse without that. Please, just help out. Don't just bash away at the people that have done a significant amount of work to ensure YOUR fishing remains open.

[Matt]

YA MAY WANNA REMEMBER MANY OF US HAVE BEEN IN THIS FIGHT SINCE THE OXNARD MEETING WHICH WAS MAINLY ATTENDED BY SAN DIEGO FISHERMAN!!! OR EVEN BEFORE THAT!!! AND THAT PRESENCE THAT STARTED AT THAT MEETING AND THAT LETTER WRITING CAMPAIGN STARTED AT THAT MEETING WAS THEN JOINED BY THE SPEAROS AND LOTS MORE BWE, BLOODYDECKERS, LJKF'ERS, PLASTIC NAVY GUYS ET. AL AND ARE QUITE POSSIBLY THE MAIN REASON LJ WAS NOT RIPPED APART AS HARD AS PT. DUME OR LAGUNA!!!!

IT ISN'T IN FRONT OF THE MLPA BOARD IT'S IN FRONT OF THE DFG COMMISSION WHICH AT THIS POINT CAN AMEND CERTAIN THINGS PM IF YOU WOULD LIKE THE FULL REAL INFO!!!



AND JUST SO YA KNOW THE DFG COMMISSION IS NOT VOTED IN AT ALL, IN FACT THE GOVERNATOR APPOINTED THE CURRENT GROUP OR THE MAJORITY OF THE CURRENT COMMISSION . THE MLPA BOARD OR BRTF AND RSG MEMBERS ARE NOW OUT OF THE PICTURE ENTIRELY.....EVERYONE WHO SITS CURRENTLY ON THE BOARD WERE APPOINTED BY YOUR BLESSED REPUBLICAN PARTY........SO WRITE THEM, AND THEN SHOW UP ON DEC. 9 AND DEC.10 AND SIGN UP FOR SPEAKING TIME IF YOU CAN THAT WILL MAKE THE DIFFERENCE. OH AND I THINK I MENTIONED WRITING TO YOUR POLITICIANS INSTEAD OF WRITING ON A FISHING BOARD WHERE IT DOES NO GOOD AT ALL!!!!!!!

GET CURRENT WITH THE SITUATION AND THEN YOUR POLITICAL BANTER WILL MAKE ALOT MORE SENSE......

[bellcon]

When it comes to the world of kayak fishing,
I don't really care what freakin political party you belong to.

If your a Republican and you voiced support for the work group 3 proposal
you got your name on the chit list

If your a Democrat and you voiced support for the work group 3 proposal
you got your name on the chit list

The Chit list is long
But it would be ridiculously long
and just plain stupid
to try and include the names of those politicians, corporations, organizations or foundations that voiced a strong stance (or any stance) against the MLPA. (That would be the "supporters" or "Our Friends" list)

I do know more than a few "republicans" who are elected officials that took a stance against the MLPA
and I sent Dean Flores a letter of support and thanks along time ago.

But in context, I could really careless what their wider political views are, or frankly where they stand in regards to their religious beliefs.

This is about the MLPA. specifically the South Coast Region MLPA,
and if you are not with us you are against us, period.

United we stand
and
Divided... we stand around looking like a bunch a dicks.

P.S
If you have the name of a politician who needs to be added to the Chit list lets add it...
but remember you don't get on the list by not being proactively against the MLPA
you get on the list for being proactively in support of the MLPA.

And yes Arnold is on the chit list... and he is a "republican", but really he is more of a RINO:D


Double P.S.
I wish BWE would make a private MLPA board
So these rants would have less eyes on them

Have a nice day:cheers1:
and may God (or whatever floats your yak) Bless you with some awesome fishing and a great Thanksgiving.

[Matt]

THANK YOU TYLER AND BELLCON!

[Tman]

Wow...

No poli-bs here, just facts.

Along with a bunch of SD yakkers, Clay and I attended the Oxnard meeting. Then, since the room was sparsely populated by us, we had minutes, minutes to speak, Clay spoke, got an ovation, and great points were made. Clapping was allowed then...then.

Since more people were made aware by the efforts of a few, we know who they are, our voices were heard, our minutes chopped to quarter minutes, and no clapping allowed. They knew what they were doing, RR'ing us and it was obvious. As it got later in the game, the BRTF were no longer cordial, because they tried to keep the 'extensive public input' under wraps. But the word got out.

Point I am making, I agree with comments by those who have put in the time. I am not doing it for me, I want to be able to take my pride and joy out kayaking with me in a safe manner. It is our bond, and just as I am willing to fight for it, so is he.

Why don't we take all of this banter and direct it towards saving our access...

I just wish we had this much enthusiasm, views, and input in Oxnard.

We have made a difference in our region, and now is not the time to ease up nor is it the time to argue amongst ourselves...that is what they want.

[Iceman]

Arguing over broad partisan politics gets us no where. We need to stay specific to the MLPA topic. I am sure there are politics boards to argue the broader point.

This post is too important to let wander WAY off course. I cleaned it up!

Keep your politics and name calling off this site.

This thread is a source of great information, don't be afraid to ask questions.

[lambadmin]

Thanks Andy!

All - please spare us your political views and agenda. There are plenty of political forums out there. You can praise your favored political party on those forums and tell the world how great your party did in fighting MLPA... :(

[Billy V]

Thanks Andy-

This MLPA issue is far from over, and we should all stay focused for the up coming meeting on Dec. 9th and 10th.
-----------

[tylerdurden]

Thanks moderators.

Back to December 9th and 10th...
News will be coming along after the thanksgiving weekend so stay tuned.

[Fiskadoro]

This post is too important to let wander WAY off course. I cleaned it up!

Thanks Andy!! Sorry for my part in it I just found the idea of a poster hijacking this issue just for partisan reasons or push one party over another in extremely bad taste. This is not a partisan issue we all have to do our part to keep our waters open. That means writing your officials no matter who you traditionally vote for.

Thanks again, Jim

[dsafety]

Please add my apologies to those expressed by Jim. Those who feel this thread went way off track are absolutly right. I am apologize if my comments helped to stir the pot.

Bob