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Old 04-24-2015, 04:09 PM   #21
Lipripper92592
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Originally Posted by StinkyMatt View Post
Your Mom was a teacher and you are saying teachers could not hang in the real world?


Show your post to your Mom, see if you get invited to Thanksgiving this year?

She is well aware of this statement....I learned this one from dad. In their age, they come to my house now. And they are both still happily married for 40 some years. It's not hanging in the real world that I am talking about. It's the private sector. I just don't know of many teachers/professors that moved into the private sector non teaching world and were successful in it. It could be that it was too hard to give up 3 months of vacation a year One of my Environmental Law professors was active law partner but his excuse was that he was getting to old to litigate.
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Old 04-24-2015, 04:12 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by Lipripper92592 View Post
NOAA has been playing a Climate Change game manipulating past temperature datasets to make the present climate seem more warm that past temperatures.
There is well documented evidence of this, cached NOAA pages have shown this as well as the raw datasets.
Just curious, but do you have any evidence on this? I would love to see it
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Old 04-24-2015, 05:33 PM   #23
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Old 04-24-2015, 05:38 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by Lipripper92592 View Post
...It could be that it was too hard to give up 3 months of vacation a year ...

If your mother was a teacher than you should be well aware that those 3 months are NOT vacation, that is unpaid time off.
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Old 04-24-2015, 05:45 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by Lipripper92592 View Post
I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that most people that are "for" this type of new legislation live on or near the coast. Please keep in mind, that some people do not live on the coast and get to fish in with any regularity. Therefore the once a year angler gets "screwed" and the folks with free time and boats.....well they have it a different way. I have a proposal that should "level" the playing field for all involved, this being the sport boats and commercials as well as the private anglers.
IF we truly believe that reducing the catch will ensure that the overall stocks go up, then why not have a tag system for keeping BFT. Price per fish, min and max size limits. YOU pay to play.
Please I hope that NOAA has "earned" your trust. They sure haven't earned mine. Our Deputy Directory in the Northwest has no Environmental Experience or training/education....she is a trained politician....PHd in political science.
The Director of the Southwest.....25 + years in academics......no real world experience, university funded studies. There is some old saying around that goes something like this..." those that don't know much......teach". And nothing against teachers, in my experience, they tend to be the ones who couldn't hang in the business/private sector world.
NOAA has been playing a Climate Change game manipulating past temperature datasets to make the present climate seem more warm that past temperatures.
There is well documented evidence of this, cached NOAA pages have shown this as well as the raw datasets.
Why would I be inclined to believe their stock assessments. Unless they can convince the public they are solving "problems" they will loose funding. I'm not saying the stocks have not dropped. Please consider the "rights" you are willing to sacrifice for yourself, and force on others all in the name of environmentalism. Unfortunately most good environmental groups have been high jacked for political purposes, thus it's very hard to find good studies on the subject. Just check the background of the sitting board members......should give you lots' of confidence in the studies they produce.
I'm guessing that most people who are against this type of legislation are the same rednecks who get most of their data from Facebook and claim that global climate change is part of the liberal media's political agenda.
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Old 04-24-2015, 05:47 PM   #26
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But I do kinda like the tag system for tuna. interesting idea.
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Old 04-24-2015, 06:00 PM   #27
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I'd say most people share your feeling of hopelessness.

Politically speaking... Recreational fisherman have no money and therefore no lobbying power in congress. The only chance WE have is to align ourselves with the scientific and conservationist movement, and promote our sport as responsible and sustainable. If it doesn't happen in your lifetime, it will never happen as the resource will be gone forever.

I don't see us gaining any traction in the scientific community as long as you have anglers griping and complaining about every regulation and marine reserve. Not to mention the cruelty to the sealions. All you sea lion haters need to shut up and quit giving us a bad name.

You take 20 minutes to reel in a 15 lb yellowtail, then complain about how a sea lion "stole" it from you?! Ha... That sea lion is just smarter than you! At least you can now claim that it was a 40lber lol

Lol, to funny, you totally missed it; as in a swing and a strike times 3.
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Old 04-24-2015, 09:15 PM   #28
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The links and Graphs are still good

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Originally Posted by dos ballenas View Post
Just curious, but do you have any evidence on this? I would love to see it
Take your time on this one. Please check out the links, and the data on the links. Please compare the dates on the data, and the dates on the graphs.
Please read the articles quoted, at GISS, EPA, and NOAA.
https://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/...tipping-point/
http://www.epa.gov/climatechange/sci...low-temps.html
http://www.giss.nasa.gov/research/briefs/hansen_07/
https://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/...-at-ushcngiss/
http://wattsupwiththat.com/2012/09/2...a-quality-act/

In the Science World, data integrity is everything. I'm not aiming to change your opinions, just please be aware that just because it has a government label behind it does not mean it does not have an agenda.

This is straight from the GISS:
Q. Do the raw data ever change?
A. The raw data always stays the same, except for occasional reported corrections or replacements of preliminary data from one source by reports obtained later from a more trusted source.

So why did the raw data change? It will take a good day to sift through the datasets and overlay them, but let me know if you come up with a different conclusion.
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Old 04-24-2015, 09:24 PM   #29
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I'm sorry I shouldn't call names or make harsh comments. I just feel passionate about this issue...
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Old 04-24-2015, 09:29 PM   #30
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Once would be ignorant to believe

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Originally Posted by chris138 View Post
I'm guessing that most people who are against this type of legislation are the same rednecks who get most of their data from Facebook and claim that global climate change is part of the liberal media's political agenda.
That climate change does not exist. The fossil record proves that the climate changes. The weather is not the same year to year. It only snowed twice in the redneck town I grew up in. The difference in the train of thought is did "we" cause this climate change, or is this a "normal" part of the natural cycles we know little about.
No need for name calling, I may be a redneck but I take offense at you assuming I have a facebook account. BWE and BD is my social media.
May I ask who you trust for you data sources? Rest assured I do not get my datasets from facebook, the above links might give you clues as to what sites a carouse. ( sorry I didn't include mother jones in there, but I do check it out) A healthy debate is necessary, but let us please stick to what we perceive as facts, until properly corrected.
Hope you get an opportunity to get that "solo" kayak BFT this summer, and if not this summer, the next, or the next, or the next.
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Old 04-24-2015, 09:32 PM   #31
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No worries my friend

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I'm sorry I shouldn't call names or make harsh comments. I just feel passionate about this issue...
I have a feeling we could have a healthy debate anytime.
No sweat, it's good to be passionate about something rather than nothing.
And you can't go wrong with being passionate about fishing. It's in my blood, probably in yours, most likely fighting for the same things, just possibly different avenues of attack.
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Old 04-24-2015, 10:17 PM   #32
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Lip ripper,

The very first link you provided starts with two negative comments about Obama......it took no more than 3 seconds to establish the credibility of your link. It was bustin on the president and not talking science. Never made it to the second link.


I got to get going now....FOX NEWS is running a special on global warming myths....( but you already knew that)




Tight lines my scientist friend.

Last edited by StinkyMatt; 04-24-2015 at 10:18 PM. Reason: Spelling
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Old 04-25-2015, 07:04 AM   #33
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Why smear? Can't refute the data?

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Originally Posted by StinkyMatt View Post
Lip ripper,

The very first link you provided starts with two negative comments about Obama......it took no more than 3 seconds to establish the credibility of your link. It was bustin on the president and not talking science. Never made it to the second link.


I got to get going now....FOX NEWS is running a special on global warming myths....( but you already knew that)




Tight lines my scientist friend.
Great tactic my friend!!!!! You learn well. (Rules for radicals?)
Please highlight the word Obama in the below article. Unless I am having some eyesight issues, I don't see him mentioned at all.
NOAA Data Tampering Reaches A Tipping Point

Posted on November 3, 2013 by stevengoddard
NOAA reported that September was the warmest ever on Earth, even though satellites showed September as being close to the median.
This tipped me off that they have gone into full cheating, damn the torpedoes mode. Check out the level of tampering they achieved for September US temperatures. NCDC shows a strong warming trend for September in the US.

http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/cag/time-series/us/
But the actual thermometer data which they use shows a cooling trend.

Index of /pub/data/ghcn/daily/hcn/
I immediately knew that we were looking at a record data tampering event. They have now passed two degrees of cheating in the US record. The graph below shows the difference between NCDC measured and reported data. As you can see, they are basically reducing temperatures from the past linearly with age.

NOAA has degenerated into a spectacularly immoral state, where their primary purpose seems to be to generate climate propaganda. Last week they were lying again about the 1,000 year rainfall in Colorado. It is pathetic.



Where does it say anything about Obama in this article? If you don't believe the data, you are more than free to do so. That is your right. But you did not refute the data. You smeared my sources by adding something that was not there.
Heavy tactic you have there my friend.
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Old 04-25-2015, 07:18 AM   #34
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So because there are small discrepancies in temperature data which may have been "modified" by NOAA, then we should dismiss the entire organization, and indeed the 100 years plus of collective scientific knowledge generated by NOAA researchers?

If there was a CAT 5 hurricane bearing down on your family's home and NOAA, who is the only reputable marine weather service we have, predicted landfall nearby, would you call mom up and say "I dunno mom... These kooks over at NWS often falsify their data and are likely exaggerating the danger"? I think not.

I trust NOAA wholeheartedly, with my life. So do you, and you don't even realize it. Where do you think all the marine weather data comes from? Magic seaweed?? They have been directly responsible for saving thousands of lives and billions of dollars worth of property, and that's only in the last couple decades. I have many friends who work at fisheries and my girlfriend works at Scripps. Of course, they have an agenda like any other well funded organization. 2012 was a cold year water wise. I'm not surprised there were discrepancies in their data set.

But saying human induced global climate change isn't real, now that is pseudo-science. Sure the geologic record shows climate change, even dramatic in scale. The current patterns we are experiencing are UNPRECEDENTED in the geologic record... Like 1000x faster than we have any record of. Does it mean global warming or ice age? I don't know and won't venture to guess... But assuming some rightwing internet trolls knows more about global climate than the ARMY of PhDs from NOAA is a real shame. You are asserting that there is some conspiracy and that scientists are purposefully misinforming the public? These scientists argue with each other more than they would ever debate with a outside entity. All they do is try to prove each other wrong. Do you realize the amount of proof and peer defense that a team has to go through to even present an idea as a HYPOTHESIS, let alone a theory? Please give them a little more credit.

These are the same guys who have completely shut down the commercial sardine fishery this year. Why would they do something silly like that? Maybe it's because they are the only ones preventing man from completely decimating what is left of our ocean?
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Old 04-25-2015, 08:13 AM   #35
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Old 04-25-2015, 12:02 PM   #36
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How they go from 10 to 2 in one change kinda tells me that they aren't paying attention and just had another "Oh Shit" moment.

I hate government regulation but it's a necessary evil, like government itself.
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Old 04-25-2015, 01:46 PM   #37
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Gawd, at least with Facebook I would not have to keep seeing posts by zealots using Hyperbole and Metaphor to argue their "facts". I delete any "friends" that do that for anything but a joke (on either side of issues). If a raindrop falls on your head, does that really mean that the sky is falling?
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Old 04-25-2015, 02:51 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lipripper92592 View Post
Take your time on this one. Please check out the links, and the data on the links. Please compare the dates on the data, and the dates on the graphs.
Please read the articles quoted, at GISS, EPA, and NOAA.
https://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/...tipping-point/
http://www.epa.gov/climatechange/sci...low-temps.html
http://www.giss.nasa.gov/research/briefs/hansen_07/
https://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/...-at-ushcngiss/
http://wattsupwiththat.com/2012/09/2...a-quality-act/

In the Science World, data integrity is everything. I'm not aiming to change your opinions, just please be aware that just because it has a government label behind it does not mean it does not have an agenda.

This is straight from the GISS:
Q. Do the raw data ever change?
A. The raw data always stays the same, except for occasional reported corrections or replacements of preliminary data from one source by reports obtained later from a more trusted source.

So why did the raw data change? It will take a good day to sift through the datasets and overlay them, but let me know if you come up with a different conclusion.
Does this paper explain who is changing the data and why?

http://scienceandpublicpolicy.org/im...o-DC_Brief.pdf

Hardly seems like a conspiracy to me. If anything, seems to me, at worst making poor conclusions on faulty data.
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Old 04-25-2015, 03:53 PM   #39
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My graph

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Old 04-26-2015, 08:51 PM   #40
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