Gut check--Are we quitters??? Do we defend our turfs or are we sheep? - Kayak Fishing Adventures on Big Water’s Edge

zenspearo · 07-20-2009, 03:43 PM

Guys and gals,

We are done with two rounds and the last and most important round is coming up. Round 3.

Everything is off the table and discussed anew. But we have set a good tone going into it.

I know people are feeling tired of hearing about MLPA but we can't let up now. We are near the finish line and we can easily let ourselves get trampled if we don't keep up. It's a marathon--and sitting out near the finish line doesn't cut it.

Two measly meetings.

A BRTF meeting on July 28/29 in Santa Monica and a RSG meeting in Carlsbad on August 3/4.

The tireless work of our RSG reps and other pro-access RSG reps as well as scores of spearos/fishermen have set the tone going into this round 3. The enviro side are aghast at their miscalculations and couldn't comprehend that most of SoCal do not support the drastic closures proposed by External C. But they have powerful friends and deep pocket support, and they are crying wolf. And like a wounded beast, they are at their most dangerous.

You can bet that the following will happen at the next BRTF meeting on July 28 and 29.

1) The SAT will, unsurprisingly, declare that most/all of the current maps do not satisfy the science guidelines. What they don't say is that the SoCal environment is 20% reef/kelp, 80% sand that their guidelines are draconian and would result in closing nearly ALL fishing areas. Hmmm, wonder if the scent of money has anything to do with their "best-available-science" findings.

2) The anti-fishing RSG will cry that they are somehow oppressed. As if they were children and need protection. Even in groups that achieved concensus in round 2 (Topaz, Opal, etc.) you will hear some anti-fishing RSG reps now claiming after the fact that they didn't really have a chance to be heard . Victimhood will be played to the max, despite the fact that their side finance the whole deal, and many of their reps are paid full-time professionals of enviro organizations, unlike our band of volunteer fishermen/spearo reps.

3) Efforts will be made to push the BRTF to give guidance for round 3 maps based strictly on the draconian SAT guidelines (which, as we know, are based on incomplete science and oh-so-nonbiased).

4) Efforts will also be made to push the BRTF "address" the imaginary "intimidation" felt by the enviro RSG reps to give them preferential guidance (another victimhood play). The enviro side will angle for favorable treatment based on imaginary injustices of round 2.

5) There will be an effort to discount the socio-economic impact to community, to continue the refrain of "temporary economic impact" that in their mind should be ignored in view of the need to close, close, close and close as much as possible right now.

6) One BRTF member will go all out in pushing the anti-access agenda. The abandonment of any pretense of neutrality or fairness happened at the last BRTF meeting over External C. The gloves are off and fishermen/spearos should expect that the all-out push will be on, and niceties such as fairness and appearance of neutrality will disappear at least with one BRTF member. It's going to be ugly.

The only viable counter-balance to all this is YOU. That's right. You are the only group that biased money hasn't been able to buy or influence. You form the "stakeholder-driven" component of this process, something they would rather have buried and let them decide for you. Your presence will serve to restrain the overt selling of our spearing/fishing spots to closure interests.

Two more meetings. I'm asking all kayakfishermen, spearos and fishermen to do a gut-check. Are we quitters????

Show up in force and provide the ONLY counterbalance to the relentless anti-access push. If we take our foot off the pedal now, we will be run over.

Two more meetings. Let's do it kayakfishermen, spearos and fishermen. Let's make these the most well-attended meetings the anti-access people, in their worst nightmares, couldn't imagine. They would rather you shut up, be left out, and let them decide for you in backroom deals.

Hundreds of kayakfishermen, spearos and fishermen need to be there to finish this out. Let them know you are representing SoCal and expect them to do the right thing for SoCal.

Two more meetings. Don't let your future be decided by the anti-access forces. Be there.

Blue Ribbon Task Force meeting (the super-important guidance forming one)
July 28-29, 2009
July 28: 9:00 a.m. – 5:30 p.m.
July 29: 8:00 a.m. – 4:00 p.m.
PUBLIC COMMENT TIME: At approximately 4:30 p.m. on Tuesday, July 28, 2009 and at 8:00 a.m. on Wednesday, July 29, 2009.
Sheraton Delfina Santa Monica
530 Pico Blvd.
Santa Monica, CA 90405

RSG meeting (the really ugly one):
August 3-4, 2009
August 3: Meeting
9:30 a.m.
Holiday Inn
850 Palomar Airport Road
Carlsbad, CA 92008
August 4: Work Session
8:00 a.m.
Hilton Garden Inn
6450 Carlsbad Blvd.
Carlsbad, CA 92011

Let's ROLL CALL!!!!

zenspearo · 07-20-2009, 03:52 PM

Guys,

As usual, if you can cross-post over the other kayakfishing websites, that would be awesome.

We work best when we give an all-out kayakfishermen/spearo/fishermen push. This is among the last.

Let's finish in style.

bellcon · 07-20-2009, 05:23 PM

Thanks Joe,
I will make sure it gets on over at Baytubers.com

Holy Mackerel · 07-20-2009, 08:35 PM

I am there in Carlsbad August 3rd!

Billy V · 07-20-2009, 09:35 PM

Is there going to be Public Comment at all 4 meeting dates ?
-----------------------

Matt · 07-20-2009, 09:40 PM

Checked it, it's still there!!

I will be at the public comment fo' sho'!!!!!

NOT TO SOUND LIKE A BULLY BUT I BOUGHT A SKIFF AND WILL WAKE AND BUZZ ANYONE AND EVERYONE THAT DOESNT SHOW UP TO THE MEETING THAT FISHES LJ!!!....Just kidding but please go and we can go celebrate at Pizza Port after, first round is on me to the first 50 dudes that show up that Yak fish!

Seriously!

Tman · 07-21-2009, 12:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt

NOT TO SOUND LIKE A BULLY BUT I BOUGHT A SKIFF AND WILL WAKE AND BUZZ ANYONE AND EVERYONE THAT DOESNT SHOW UP TO THE MEETING THAT FISHES LJ!!!....Just kidding but please go and we can go celebrate at Pizza Port after, first round is on me to the first 50 dudes that show up that Yak fish!

Seriously!

WHAT? YOU BOUGHT A SKIFF?

MY HOME WATERS?

Does the first round include food?

Jussst sayin'...

tylerdurden · 07-21-2009, 06:35 AM

Public comment is on July 28, 29 and August 3. August 4th we can only just watch.

I really wish they would put out the schedule more than 2 weeks ahead of time. It makes it tough to get out of work with less than 2 weeks notice.

August 3rd for sure. Pizza Port won't know what hit them. I missed out last time after the open house.

For the BRTF meeting, maybe split it up, have a group do the 28th and another group do the 29th? I am trying to make it for the 28th.
For July 28, if I leave San Diego at 12, can I make it to the meeting by 4:30? What would the expected drive time be?

Jason · 07-21-2009, 07:28 AM

I'll be there August 3rd or 4th.

Jason

dgax65 · 07-21-2009, 09:54 AM

I can probably make both. Is this going to be a color-coordinated show of force, or is it more low key?

tylerdurden · 07-21-2009, 10:14 AM

I would say more low key. Save the color coordinated stuff for when it matters more, don't wear out the impact before it's needed again. Just my thoughts.

Remember there is no public comment August 4th. There is a workshop we can witness, but we have no input. August 3rd is the day they take our public comment, then put it to use the 4th.

Matt · 07-21-2009, 02:25 PM

Alright so August 3rd it is!!! BUMP get yer asses there!! PLEASE!!

kurt · 07-21-2009, 02:33 PM

Quote:

if I leave San Diego at 12, can I make it to the meeting by 4:30

Yes. Should be no problem. Leaving after 1, you don't know what sort of traffic you'll hit.

tylerdurden · 07-21-2009, 03:52 PM

bump. Burned out on the whole freaking thing. I am in for July 28th pending work approval. Man I hate using MY vacation days for this, again

.

Kayak fisherman, pm or email me for speaking points if you want them. I will get them to you in a few days.

tylerdurden · 07-23-2009, 03:56 PM

bump again. This time next year there may not be any fishing left in LJ, PV, or where ever your favorite kayak spot is.

07-20-2009, 03:43 PM	#1
zenspearo Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 167	Gut check--Are we quitters??? Do we defend our turfs or are we sheep? Guys and gals, We are done with two rounds and the last and most important round is coming up. Round 3. Everything is off the table and discussed anew. But we have set a good tone going into it. I know people are feeling tired of hearing about MLPA but we can't let up now. We are near the finish line and we can easily let ourselves get trampled if we don't keep up. It's a marathon--and sitting out near the finish line doesn't cut it. Two measly meetings. A BRTF meeting on July 28/29 in Santa Monica and a RSG meeting in Carlsbad on August 3/4. The tireless work of our RSG reps and other pro-access RSG reps as well as scores of spearos/fishermen have set the tone going into this round 3. The enviro side are aghast at their miscalculations and couldn't comprehend that most of SoCal do not support the drastic closures proposed by External C. But they have powerful friends and deep pocket support, and they are crying wolf. And like a wounded beast, they are at their most dangerous. You can bet that the following will happen at the next BRTF meeting on July 28 and 29. 1) The SAT will, unsurprisingly, declare that most/all of the current maps do not satisfy the science guidelines. What they don't say is that the SoCal environment is 20% reef/kelp, 80% sand that their guidelines are draconian and would result in closing nearly ALL fishing areas. Hmmm, wonder if the scent of money has anything to do with their "best-available-science" findings. 2) The anti-fishing RSG will cry that they are somehow oppressed. As if they were children and need protection. Even in groups that achieved concensus in round 2 (Topaz, Opal, etc.) you will hear some anti-fishing RSG reps now claiming after the fact that they didn't really have a chance to be heard . Victimhood will be played to the max, despite the fact that their side finance the whole deal, and many of their reps are paid full-time professionals of enviro organizations, unlike our band of volunteer fishermen/spearo reps. 3) Efforts will be made to push the BRTF to give guidance for round 3 maps based strictly on the draconian SAT guidelines (which, as we know, are based on incomplete science and oh-so-nonbiased). 4) Efforts will also be made to push the BRTF "address" the imaginary "intimidation" felt by the enviro RSG reps to give them preferential guidance (another victimhood play). The enviro side will angle for favorable treatment based on imaginary injustices of round 2. 5) There will be an effort to discount the socio-economic impact to community, to continue the refrain of "temporary economic impact" that in their mind should be ignored in view of the need to close, close, close and close as much as possible right now. 6) One BRTF member will go all out in pushing the anti-access agenda. The abandonment of any pretense of neutrality or fairness happened at the last BRTF meeting over External C. The gloves are off and fishermen/spearos should expect that the all-out push will be on, and niceties such as fairness and appearance of neutrality will disappear at least with one BRTF member. It's going to be ugly. The only viable counter-balance to all this is YOU. That's right. You are the only group that biased money hasn't been able to buy or influence. You form the "stakeholder-driven" component of this process, something they would rather have buried and let them decide for you. Your presence will serve to restrain the overt selling of our spearing/fishing spots to closure interests. Two more meetings. I'm asking all kayakfishermen, spearos and fishermen to do a gut-check. Are we quitters???? Show up in force and provide the ONLY counterbalance to the relentless anti-access push. If we take our foot off the pedal now, we will be run over. Two more meetings. Let's do it kayakfishermen, spearos and fishermen. Let's make these the most well-attended meetings the anti-access people, in their worst nightmares, couldn't imagine. They would rather you shut up, be left out, and let them decide for you in backroom deals. Hundreds of kayakfishermen, spearos and fishermen need to be there to finish this out. Let them know you are representing SoCal and expect them to do the right thing for SoCal. Two more meetings. Don't let your future be decided by the anti-access forces. Be there. Blue Ribbon Task Force meeting (the super-important guidance forming one) July 28-29, 2009 July 28: 9:00 a.m. – 5:30 p.m. July 29: 8:00 a.m. – 4:00 p.m. PUBLIC COMMENT TIME: At approximately 4:30 p.m. on Tuesday, July 28, 2009 and at 8:00 a.m. on Wednesday, July 29, 2009. Sheraton Delfina Santa Monica 530 Pico Blvd. Santa Monica, CA 90405 RSG meeting (the really ugly one): August 3-4, 2009 August 3: Meeting 9:30 a.m. Holiday Inn 850 Palomar Airport Road Carlsbad, CA 92008 August 4: Work Session 8:00 a.m. Hilton Garden Inn 6450 Carlsbad Blvd. Carlsbad, CA 92011 Let's ROLL CALL!!!! __________________ A spearo, but we are in this MLPA mess together

07-20-2009, 03:52 PM	#2
zenspearo Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 167	Guys, As usual, if you can cross-post over the other kayakfishing websites, that would be awesome. We work best when we give an all-out kayakfishermen/spearo/fishermen push. This is among the last. Let's finish in style. __________________ A spearo, but we are in this MLPA mess together

07-20-2009, 09:40 PM	#6
Matt Support your local pangas Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Lj Posts: 976	Checked it, it's still there!! I will be at the public comment fo' sho'!!!!! NOT TO SOUND LIKE A BULLY BUT I BOUGHT A SKIFF AND WILL WAKE AND BUZZ ANYONE AND EVERYONE THAT DOESNT SHOW UP TO THE MEETING THAT FISHES LJ!!!....Just kidding but please go and we can go celebrate at Pizza Port after, first round is on me to the first 50 dudes that show up that Yak fish! Seriously! __________________ Thanks Matt F.

07-21-2009, 06:35 AM	#8
tylerdurden Bad Clone Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 874	Public comment is on July 28, 29 and August 3. August 4th we can only just watch. I really wish they would put out the schedule more than 2 weeks ahead of time. It makes it tough to get out of work with less than 2 weeks notice. August 3rd for sure. Pizza Port won't know what hit them. I missed out last time after the open house. For the BRTF meeting, maybe split it up, have a group do the 28th and another group do the 29th? I am trying to make it for the 28th. For July 28, if I leave San Diego at 12, can I make it to the meeting by 4:30? What would the expected drive time be? __________________ MLPA, if you are not part of the solution, you are part of the problem Let the Fish and Game Commission know what you think about the proposed maps. Be ready for December 9th and 10th.

07-21-2009, 09:54 AM	#10
dgax65 Guerro Grande Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 629	I can probably make both. Is this going to be a color-coordinated show of force, or is it more low key? __________________ Douglas Gaxiola Team No Fish- Amateur Staff

07-20-2009, 05:23 PM	#3
bellcon Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: San Pedro Posts: 999	Thanks Joe, I will make sure it gets on over at Baytubers.com

07-20-2009, 08:35 PM	#4
Holy Mackerel Señor member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 1,627	I am there in Carlsbad August 3rd!

07-20-2009, 09:35 PM	#5
Billy V Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Bay Ho Posts: 1,382	Is there going to be Public Comment at all 4 meeting dates ? -----------------------

07-21-2009, 07:28 AM	#9
Jason Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Carlsbad Posts: 80	I'll be there August 3rd or 4th. Jason

07-21-2009, 10:14 AM	#11
tylerdurden Bad Clone Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 874	I would say more low key. Save the color coordinated stuff for when it matters more, don't wear out the impact before it's needed again. Just my thoughts. Remember there is no public comment August 4th. There is a workshop we can witness, but we have no input. August 3rd is the day they take our public comment, then put it to use the 4th. __________________ MLPA, if you are not part of the solution, you are part of the problem Let the Fish and Game Commission know what you think about the proposed maps. Be ready for December 9th and 10th.

07-21-2009, 02:25 PM	#12
Matt Support your local pangas Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Lj Posts: 976	Alright so August 3rd it is!!! BUMP get yer asses there!! PLEASE!! __________________ Thanks Matt F.

07-21-2009, 03:52 PM	#14
tylerdurden Bad Clone Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 874	bump. Burned out on the whole freaking thing. I am in for July 28th pending work approval. Man I hate using MY vacation days for this, again . Kayak fisherman, pm or email me for speaking points if you want them. I will get them to you in a few days. __________________ MLPA, if you are not part of the solution, you are part of the problem Let the Fish and Game Commission know what you think about the proposed maps. Be ready for December 9th and 10th.

07-23-2009, 03:56 PM	#15
tylerdurden Bad Clone Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 874	bump again. This time next year there may not be any fishing left in LJ, PV, or where ever your favorite kayak spot is. __________________ MLPA, if you are not part of the solution, you are part of the problem Let the Fish and Game Commission know what you think about the proposed maps. Be ready for December 9th and 10th.